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Thread: Oscars... the punch...

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    Moderator VJ's Avatar
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    Default Oscars... the punch...

    I know not many people will read this, but I want to write it somewhere.

    In the whole Smith-Rock saga, I feel everyone seems to forget how much words can hurt. Of course slapping a person is not acceptable and should have consequences, but as a person who punched his bully during biology class, I can understand how seemingly simple comments can trigger you. And as a victim, you always have to be the bigger person: everyone tells you they are just words, that you should let it pass, but it hard. You are just powerless, and everyone tells you to "let it go". The saga created a bit of a sense of understanding for the disease of Jade, but it did not do anything for creating understanding of how, what can be a simple joke to one can really hurt. This is something I think only the victim knows, I'm even willing to accept that not all bullies, and for sure not people more from the outside that just make a bad joke, grasp the magnitude of that impact.

    For me, this lack of consequences for Chris Rock rips open old wounds. He has not apologised, his ticket sales are through the roof, and everyone is admiring how well he handled it. He claimed he did not know about the disease, but I don't buy that: it was public knowledge. I can believe he did not know his comment would trigger Smith the way it did, but he should now at least show some understanding... Maybe it is why he is quiet on the topic...? Many comments of people are that they are in shock of the violence, but they overlook the fact that this was just a visible consequence of non-visible issues going on for years. This slap should not have happened and should have consequences, no discussion there, but it is not a type of event to be compared against e.g. domestic violence (comparisons which I already saw in newspapers). It would have been so different if Smith would have gone on stage and said something along the lines of "Chris Rock, ladies and gentlemen. The man throwing salt in wounds for the enjoyment of millions. Providing material for bullies all over the world! And you all laugh with it...". But at such times you just don't think straight, and in hindsight it is easy.

    My bully, after I punched him, was so shocked he actually took the blame for the punch: he told the teacher it was his fault. Or course I was punished, but because of his admission he also got punished. Of course the bullying continued a few days later, less though as he lost esteem in his group (and arguing it was a sissy punch with a black eye for a week does not carry well ), but boy was my punishment worth it and boy did that feel good.

    I've never told this story after leaving that school (it is almost 30 years ago and never punched anyone since), my wife does not know... but I still remember it as one of my most vivid memories: the immediate trigger, the teacher's reaction, the shocked bully proclaiming "it was my fault", the atmosphere in the class immediately afterwards, shocked looks, and best of all: me walking with my head up high the next day when presenting the teacher with essay I had to write as punishment and how small the bully seemed when handing in his... Not a Back-to-the-future-Biff-change, but still... And come to think of it, I also remember how seemingly no-one was surprised it led to this. They were surprised *when* it happened, but not so much *that* it happened. (I suspect that was why the teacher let me of lightly)

    I just had to post here as my own event is now replaying in my head, esp. due to the one-side way the oscar-slap is presented.
    Last edited by VJ; 1st April 2022 at 05:52.
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    Moderator Dr Mordrid's Avatar
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    I agree, if not for Chris Rock being an ****at for the last 6 years this would not have happened. You can only drive a man so far, especially when you're going after his wife or girlfriend

    A bully picked on me as a skinny 5' 6 Junior High kid. The next time he saw me I was 6'1 and 225 lb defensive tackle on the junior varsity team. Yeah, when puberty hit it hit like a nuclear weapon. The next year I was 6' 2+ and 245 lb - built like a tank. He made sure to keep his distance.
    Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 5th April 2022 at 09:05.
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    Crabby Smurf Umfriend's Avatar
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    I disagree. Yes, he could have called Chris out for it, right away and loud for all I care but you don't slap someone just like that. AFAIK, there is no history of Chris bullying either Smith. Moreover, the "joke" wasn't at his expense. It's not like Smith is a kid or anything. He is an adult who should be able to give words to his thoughts and feelings.
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    Moderator Dr Mordrid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Umfriend View Post
    AFAIK, there is no history of Chris bullying either Smith.
    .
    How would you feel if your wife had a mastectomy and some idiot asked her "how you doing Susie no tits?"

    Rock making jokes about her appearance, which is due to an autoimmune disorder, certainly explains Will Smith's reaction.

    Rock has a long history of abusive comments about Jada Pinkett Smith, but it really heated up after the 2016 Oscars when he also made crude comments at her expense. It's continued during his roadshow, and this was just a straw that broke the camel's back.

    Was it 100% justifiable for Will Smith to hit him? Probably no, but neither is it 100% unjustified. I know in this neck of the woods the speaker would wake up looking at the ceiling. No joke, no slap, a straight right hand to the face.
    Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 2nd April 2022 at 12:29.
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    Crabby Smurf Umfriend's Avatar
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    Ah, I did not know that and presumably, the Smiths had voiced their discontent earlier.
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    Moderator VJ's Avatar
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    I did not know either, but I look at it differently...

    The hair-loss is generally a topic that is very sensitive, esp. to women, and it was known she was depressed over it. That immediately makes it dangerous territory for jokes when it comes to this person. If Chris knew, then he is just bullying and went too far. If he did not (which to me is impossible, esp. between hollywood stars), he should have realized when he got punched and apologized. He is not a starting stand-up in a bar somewhere and I would expect he prepares jokes and shows: he should have known not to go there or which risks come with doing so. If what Doc says it true, then it is even worse.

    You also see that Smith does not react immediately on the joke, but gets up when the room is laughing. It may have not have happened if no-one would be laughing, but as it was he just couldn't take more of those jokes at his wife's expense (seeing the room laugh and realizing probably that viewers are also laughing), and possibly seeing more depressions and issues in the future, so he reacted. I fully agree that the reaction is wrong and should have consequences, but for sure they should not be end-of-career ones. But I do feel that Chris Rock is getting off too lightly and even benefits from it - which is probably the explanation why he went there. And that is my main gripe... he is too much portrayed as being innocent.

    Sorry, just fed up of being told too many times as a child: "It's just words. Don't react. They are stupid. It does not mean anything. Don't let them push your buttons like that. Don't listen. " But it does hurt. Day after day, week after week. So why could I not be stupid for just this once? Why do I have to be the one suffering while doing nothing wrong, and they get their laughs? And when you do react slightly, you are called out by the teacher because you are supposed to be the smart one, because it are just words. So no... you remain silent and take it, until you just cannot any more. And at that point, your reaction is not planned: I did not plan to punch my bully (he has sitting next to me, the joy of assigned seats), and I was probably the most surprised of all when I went that far. The teachers' reaction was "what happened?" and then that he assigned me an essay as punishment. And I just sat there in silence, processing what just happened. The first thing that was said after that was the bully: "it was my fault", after which the teacher split the punishment.

    PS: Doc, I'm now at my heaviest I've ever been, weighing in at a solid 59 kg for 176 cm... (130 lbs, 5'77")
    Last edited by VJ; 3rd April 2022 at 06:34.
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    Crabby Smurf Umfriend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VJ View Post
    I fully agree that the reaction is wrong and should have consequences, but for sure they should not be end-of-career ones. But I do feel that Chris Rock is getting off too lightly and even benefits from it - which is probably the explanation why he went there. And that is my main gripe... he is too much portrayed as being innocent.
    So we're in agreement then.

    PS: Doc, I'm now at my heaviest I've ever been, weighing in at a solid 59 kg for 176 cm... (130 lbs, 5'77")
    LOL, just a few pounds more, same height.
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    Moderator Dr Mordrid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Umfriend View Post
    So we're in agreement then.

    LOL, just a few pounds more, same height.
    They grow them big on Midwestern farms. I'm now 73: 6 ft 2 1/2, and can still bench 300 lb. Lifelong weightlifter.

    We had many guys on our football team from 6 ft to 6 ft 9 and over 300 lb. Same with the basketball players. This in a town of only 5,000.
    Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 5th April 2022 at 09:29.
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    Super MURCer UtwigMU's Avatar
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    One thing I learned after childhood in teens and early adult life is that internal confidence matters. People don't pick verbal or physical fights with you once they feel you can talk or fight back. The reason why it happens to kids is other kids sense kid won't fight back and no one else will stand up for him. For teachers it's easier to overlook problem and not deal with parents, for parents it's easier to say don't react. I too similarly punched a guy in the first grade.

    This is very interesting interesting video on the topic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sq60ccWHJcQ

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    Moderator VJ's Avatar
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    Yes. A couple of years after that, I was in a different school, and some bullies tried to pick on me. I did not want to go through it again and managed to end it before it started by holding the leader against a wall in the corridor, right next to the principal's office. First he laughed, but I pushed him closer and closer towards the headmaster's office, a bit bluffing my way saying that I don't care if we happen to reach the door (straight A student vs known bully). The laughing stopped. Immediately after, when I then entered onto the playground, my class applauded and cheered. I turned out one of them saw the scene and notified everyone.

    Probably that display of support of my class was what ended the bullying, more-so than the (idle) treat of violence.
    Last edited by VJ; 6th April 2022 at 03:35.
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    Moderator Dr Mordrid's Avatar
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    I started teaching our kids how to box at a young age, then they started karate classes. It taught them how to defend themselves, and self-control.

    When our daughter started having visible signs signs of puberty, she takes after her mother in being busty, she acquired a male bully who tormented her about them.

    Daughter: what do I do?

    Me: whatever you have to, just make sure he remembers it. We'll worry about the school principal later.

    Within days he did it again.

    She grabbed him by his collar and belt, slammed his face into his locker, and informed him if he harassed her again she would pop-rivet his **** (penis) to the locker door.

    Never said another word to her, and the principal got a big laugh out of it.

    Thus started her career as a tough chick. She married an ex-cop, and that is definitely one house not to break into.
    Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 7th April 2022 at 16:44.
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