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Thread: (Epox) MVP3 boards + G200 + PD5.30: Disable busmastering will solve crashes

  1. #1
    MURCer Randy Simons's Avatar
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    Exclamation (Epox) MVP3 boards + G200 + PD5.30: Disable busmastering will solve crashes

    Dunno if this is already known to you guys, but in a reply to my mail to matrox about crashes with MVP3 Epox boards and G200 with PD 5.30 they gave me a tip which I had forgotten to test before: disabling busmasting.

    So, disable the busmaster option for your G200 and things probably will run fine again, without crashes with PD5.30.

    This will result in a performance hit, but at least it works again I hope Matrox will fix things soon, so we can use busmastering again.

    Hmm, just found out that OpenGL won't go in hardware-mode.. XTom3D switches to the Microsoft GDI Generic OpenGL drivers (software)... anybody else with a solution for this?

    ------------------
    Randy Simons
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    [This message has been edited by Randy Simons (edited 12 October 1999).]

  2. #2
    Super MURCer Wombat's Avatar
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    Exclamation

    OpenGL hardware acceleration will NOT work w/o bus mastering. Disabling bus mastering should never be considered a "solution", no matter what a manufacturer says.

    -Wombat

  3. #3
    MURCer Randy Simons's Avatar
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    Unhappy

    Too bad...

    Hm.. got reply from Matrox again (within an hour... WOW MATROX, this is not what I'm used to! :-)

    The answer was less positive:

    Dear Sir,
    This problem is not our fault but the fault of all AMD based motherboards,
    since the chipset makers are not following AMD's instructions. This
    weakness is way there are even driver files in the first place.
    Hmm, I recall my mainboards was one of the recommended mainboards by AMD... Weird stuff.

    Well, rules or no rules, it used to work before, so why can't it work now?

    [This message has been edited by Randy Simons (edited 12 October 1999).]

  4. #4
    MURCer motub's Avatar
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    Question

    I suppose Matrox would say the solution is to buy a G400...? Or is it??

    I have a MAX on its way to me from the Meadowlands UPS depo, should be here today (I hope... Thanks, Jord!!! Thanks, Pauly!).. does this mean it won't work (right) till I get my P-II/BX board set up (in the near but unspecified future)?

    ...well, at least I get to show off my new .sig ....

    ------------------
    Holly
    All you people, can't you see, can't you see
    How his love's affecting my reality
    Everytime I'm down, he can make it right
    And that makes him larger than life.
    ...not to mention being 6'5", eh Jord...?
    ------------------
    What? System specs? Oh, yes, right...well, at the moment, it's: Soyo 5EMA, K6-2 333, 256MB PC100 SDRAM, Maxtor 7GB HDD, LS-120, Promise Ultra33 EIDE controller, Diamond Monster Sound MX300, HP 8100i CD-RW, Hi-Val (Nakamichi) 16X 5-disk CD changer, Win98 +SR1...oh yeah, and a Millennium G200 8MB SGRAM.



  5. #5
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    Randy,
    There is a less drastic measure than turning off busmastering for your G200. First try disabling DMA support for your CD-ROM or DVD. This worked for me and let me keep busmastering turned on for my G200. It slows access to your CD-ROM, but once accessed it runs just about as fast.

    A better solution is to install the newest VIA 4-in-1 drivers. The new VIADMATOOL it installs lets you turn on UDMA support for your hard drive and CD-ROM separately. But, the new drivers have finally let me keep both turned on and keep busmastering for the G200 on as well. You might still have some stability problems, but if you do, turn off DMA on the CD-ROM first using the VIADMATOOL.

    RAB


  6. #6
    MURCer Randy Simons's Avatar
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    Thumbs down

    Hmm, "desperate" as I am, I've tried disabeling the busmastering for my IDE device. It didn't work, as I expected, since I have both a PCI SCSI card (adaptec 2940UW) and PCI NIC (3COM 905B) which are both busmastering by definition. (thus can't be turned off)

    I believe Matrox is talking crap: I've read no complains about G400's not working on Epox MVP3 boards. Or does nobody has such a setup?

    There's only one solution: matrox, fix it.

  7. #7

    Exclamation

    Someone told me that it depends on what rev your MVP3 chip is. The later ones ("C" and "D" I believe) work better, but it's still a toss-up whether you get AGP 2X or not.

    Bill


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  8. #8
    MURCer Randy Simons's Avatar
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    Arrow

    There are 2 revisions on the board which are sold: CD and CE. Rev CD had major problems with Intel's i740 chip-based cards, and probably others too. But I've had no probs before with my CD revision board and the G200. AGP 2X never worked though.
    Now I have the same board, but newer revision and I assume (never checked actually) I have the CE revision of the MVP3 chipset. Still no AGP 2X, but I find that much less important than something like busmastering.

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    Thumbs down

    I've been using an Epox MVP3G-M (rev 1.0) mobo and had absolutely -no- compatibility problems with anything until PD5.30
    I have a G200, and was able to get agp2x mode and busmastering on and everything previously, but 5.30 crashed on any D3D or OpenGL games. Busmastering is not an option/solution in my mind because its always worked before, and I don't take well to dropping system preformance just to get something to work (when it should work w/o any bios hacking).
    So.. here is a simple solution for all the PD5.30 problems and G200s... Switch back to PD5.25 like I did, and just wait for the next PD release.

  10. #10
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    Randy,
    Here's another "fix" I had to make that I forgot to mention, but it might help. VIA chipsets apparently only busmaster the two PCI slots closest to the AGP slot. I could only get my NIC to work in the slot closest to the AGP slot on my FIC 503+. Move your NIC and SCSI card to these two slots if you haven't already.

    I also noticed that ANT posted a note on the MURC news that AGP 2x only has a chance to work on VIA boards if these two slots are only using busmastered devices. This is another reason to try moving cards.

    RAB

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    I have an efa viking III mobo AMD k6-2 350mhz. g200 8megs sgram and have had no major problems with matrox drivers,even back in beta days,until now,with 5.30 ie.3d=bsod.
    Went back to 5.25 and hope matrox comes up with a solution in their next drivers.
    Seems to be too many people with problems.
    All the boards having problems are AMD approved!So I don't buy matrox's line,think it's a case of stonewalling until they figure out what's up or down!

  12. #12
    Super MURCer Rags's Avatar
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    I buy Matrox's line, SS7 boards are some of the worst built boards out there, even if they are on AMD's recommended list. The approved boards are only tested for compatibility with AMD processors. EVERY full AGP texturing card is at a disadvantage on a SS7. Why do you think that DMA is a tough thing to achieve with a SS7? Why is it that SS7 boards have a tough time with NIC's, with new SCSI cards???? It is because the boards are TOO NOISY!!!

    Rags


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    I haven't tried the 5.30 drivers yet. But the G400 on my Epox MVP-3G board has been the most reliable set up yet. Not that I had any problems with my old g200. Rags, there are good super 7 boards out there. They might take a little more care and feeding sometimes than Intel. And I have seen some prety bad BX boards in my time. (Dell's got some nice I820 boards to sell you cheap!!!).

    Joel, any comments???



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    Super MURCer Rags's Avatar
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    carlmeister,

    I have owned/built many SS7 systems, and still own one. There is no doubt that the vast majority of the SS7 boards are no where near what they could be. I believe that the mfrs. out there could build a good SS7 solution, but there really is not much incentive to do so. Even the best current SS7 boards are not living up to the potential of the platform. My G400 runs fine with PD 5.3 on my 503+ in 2X DiME mode. My G200 runs fine in 1X mode with the current drivers, and see no issues with PD 5.3.


    Rags


  15. #15
    MURCer Holerith's Avatar
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    Cool

    A friend of mine went through 3 SS7 motherboards (FIC, EpoX, ASUS) before he finally took my advice and bought a Tyan.

    Problem solved.

    This machine is a S1590S and have had no UDMA/DMA problems, my NIC works fine, my G200 is at AGP2x DIME.

    Not that some haven't had problems with Tyan SS7 boards but there are far fewer than with other brands from all indications.

    The observation about the "CD" and CE" versions is also correct as most CE motherboards are much better. Also ALI is worse than MVP3 for problems.


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    Dean
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    PDP-11, Dec-writer & ZD-11 Terminal Unit, RSTS-OS



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