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  • Carmack vs bump-mapping

    While we wait for the hardware forum to rise from the dead....

    You may have noticed further down the index that Buuri posted a link to a message from John Carmack on what looks like a messageboard for G200 (?) developers.

    Read it:
    http://lists.openprojects.net/piperm...ne/001611.html

    What's up with that "[bump mapping] is not as useful as it sounds" line? Obviously it's one of the 2 strongest distinguishing features of the G400 (the other being dual head).

    Does he have an issue, or a point, d'ya think?
    Holly

    "All we need is a voluntary, free-spirited, open ended program of procreative racial deconstruction."
    -Jay Bulworth

  • #2
    You mean Environment Mapped Bump Mapping is the stronghold of the G400... Just plain Bump Mapping is what any 2nd or 3rd generation videocard can do by now...

    Maybe Bump Mapping isn't as pleasing when you've seen EMBM for the first time... and that all in motion... He might mean that !!

    Jorden, not a clue what JC is on about...
    Jordâ„¢

    Comment


    • #3
      Well, I assumed he meant EMBM, why else would it "need an extension to expose" if the G200, G400 or any card can do it already? I'd think that the only feature that would need to be "turned on" using additional instructions would be EMBM. Otherwise it would mean that regular "fake" bump mapping is turned off in his coding, which seems hard to believe to me (but I'm no programmer).

      I like your theory, though...keeps the G400 in it's proper position of preeminence [oooh, I didn't mean to be so alliterative ]





      ------------------
      Holly
      Soyo 5EMA, K6-2 333 not o/c, 256MB PC100--tee hee!, Millennium G200 8MB SGRAM, Win98.




      Holly

      "All we need is a voluntary, free-spirited, open ended program of procreative racial deconstruction."
      -Jay Bulworth

      Comment


      • #4
        EMBM is a function of DirectX (D3D).
        Q3 is an OGL game (NOT D3D).
        For Q3 to use EMBM, it would require writing a specific OGL extension into the OGL ICD. At this point, such an extension does not exist. Since Q3 (or any other OGL game for that matter) does not plan to make use of EMBM, it's not likely Matrox is going to spend the time to write the extension. If/when any of the Q3 engine licencees decide to use this feature, then there may be a reason to write it...guess we'll just have to wait and see...

        [This message has been edited by Kruzin (edited 06-23-99).]
        Core2 Duo E7500 2.93, Asus P5Q Pro Turbo, 4gig 1066 DDR2, 1gig Asus ENGTS250, SB X-Fi Gamer ,WD Caviar Black 1tb, Plextor PX-880SA, Dual Samsung 2494s

        Comment


        • #5
          OK, I get it (thanks, Kruzin, you're great). And I'm aware of JC's opinion of D3D vs OGL (however justified or not). But doesn't this comment of his become yet more snarky and churlish in that light? And doesn't this give D3D a gigantic boost now that only D3D games will be displaying the stupendous EMBM graphics? So how is that "not as useful as it sounds"?



          ------------------
          Holly
          Soyo 5EMA, K6-2 333 not o/c, 256MB PC100--tee hee!, Millennium G200 8MB SGRAM, Win98.




          Holly

          "All we need is a voluntary, free-spirited, open ended program of procreative racial deconstruction."
          -Jay Bulworth

          Comment


          • #6
            Well, there has always been debate between OGL and D3D. They both have their strong points, but in the end, D3D is going to win out because of the added features.

            That's not to say that for the forseeable future (at least the next couple gens of cards), that OGL won't be a big player. ID has a strong following, and the Q3 engine will be used in other games. My understanding is that the Q3 engine will support bumpmapping, so it's very possible that sometime down the line, we'll see that happen.

            But for some reason, the games I'm most interested in are the ones that are going to support it. After seeing what EMBM looks like in motion, I can't wait to see what some good mappers will do with it

            ------------------
            P2-350(@103*4=412), Asus P2B(1009), 128meg PC100, MillG400 32meg(PD5.20.???), CL SB Live!Value, CL PC-DVD, Mitsumi CD-R, WD UDMA 8.4&6.4 gig, (2)USR 56k(multilinked), 3Com 905B-TX, etc...





            Core2 Duo E7500 2.93, Asus P5Q Pro Turbo, 4gig 1066 DDR2, 1gig Asus ENGTS250, SB X-Fi Gamer ,WD Caviar Black 1tb, Plextor PX-880SA, Dual Samsung 2494s

            Comment

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