Request for notebook recommendations

[dZeus]

Hey,

I'm looking for a notebook (for my significant other) and having quite a hard time as I have no clue which brands are ok...

Requirements:
- 17" screen (15.6" could be considered if needed)
- 16 GB of RAM (either pre-installed or allowing to be upgraded to)
- available in France (she insists on the absolutely awful Azerty layout)
- fast CPU (dual core i5 or better, preferably the most future proof model (e.g. is Intel Trusted Execution Technology going to provide nice security benefits in future?)
- Windows 8 Pro (I'd like to enable bitlocker and in future maybe domain logon too). Windows 7 Pro is also an option.
- Good build quality

Don't care for:
- weight (not going to be moved much)
- battery life (she's only using it near a wall outlet)
- screen resolution (720p seems enough)

If the notebook doesn't match the requirements, it's still ok if I can manually upgrade it to the required specs (i.e. replace a mechanical HDD with a SDD, upgrade to 16 GB RAM). The main requirement is that the price is around €1100 in total max (including any necessary upgrades). That probably translates into 1100 USD considering the tax difference, localization and 'ask more because they live in Europe' margin.

Right now, she is strongly favouring Toshiba models (to my dismay, I think Tosh is not much good but her old lappy is a Tosh and she thinks it is good for reasons beyond my comprehension as it is falling apart). I'd prefer finding a good Asus or Samsung. Any ideas?

[Umfriend]

I have the ASUS N55SF, which is a 15.6" that sports 1920x1080 (1920x1200 can only be had with Dell and HP at huge prices). I like it although keyboard is a bit, uhm, suboptimal. Usuallay attach a USB keyboard. Updraged myself with an SSD an 16Gb. Comes with W7 Home Prem. I think it is a decent machine, although focused on multimedia...

I would avoid HP and Sony.

[Fat Tone]

I have a Dell XPS 17", full hd, 8Gb (upgradable to 16), space for two hdds so I upgraded to a 256gb ssd, core i7, 3d display, stereo speakers and sub woofer, the list goes on and on. Bluray and tv tuner too.

Without 3d you could get it for that sort of money.

[dZeus]

thanks for the recommendations, I'll check out these models.

[UtwigMU]

Well, this dilema usually boils down to Thinkpad or a Mac.

What's wrong with T520 or T530 or maybe W520?

~700 EUR for shipped new-grade T520
~72 EUR for 16GB Crucial
~200 EUR for SSD
~25 EUR for AZERTY after reselling the German US or UK keyboard
~optionally 40 EUR for HDD ultrabay caddy
~ 100 EUR for 1TB HDD
~ -50 EUR for reselling original drive and memory

I'd ebay in warranty T520 from Germany or UK and order the AZERTY and sell the keyboard it came with. This is what I do for Slovenian keyboards for others (not minding for myself, my X61 has US and T60p has UK layout).

Most people who have no clue about computer hardware around me seem to like Toshiba. The reasons they state is because they like design, supposedly most compatible with whatever and looks a bit like Mac.

I don't like Toshiba at all though I have one laying around. The hard drive caddies are made of paper on some models, scotch tape is used inside others. I don't like the way they are engineered, they look tacky and you cannot get service manual unless you're authorized service center.

17" laptop is really a portable desktop. For me anything bigger than 14" (doesn't fit on airplane/train table) is not a real laptop, barring mobile workstations (you need portable gaming, VM, graphics or CAD workstation)


Consider also Mini PCIe SSD + 1TB + optical. Best of all worlds (I guess 17" implies optical drive). Otherwise HP is also nice, check 8570p or 8770p - the motherboard is screwed underneath the keyboard and not on the bottom of the case. Screwless chassis opening, you can order optical HDD caddy for 20 EUR from China and it takes one screw to replace HDD with optical (no hotswap like ultrabay), has trackpoint too. Some of the 17" HP workstations 87x0w (x=year) have IPS displays. Generally I'd stay away from consumer lines but that's just me.

[dZeus]

I've been looking at the Lenovo T530, Edge 530 and L530 lines. I like how you can customize the Thinkpads a lot (like how Dell used to be.. what happened to them? Not much choice and high prices now on the Dell website).

why would you buy from ebay Germany? Are they much cheaper than the Lenovo online shop catered to your country? How does Lenovo deal with warranty across countries?

About the 'portable desktop', I fully agree. I first selected an Asus UX32VD-R4002H for her (only decent 13.3" ultrabook with IPS screen), when I learned she actually prefers a 17" bulky desktop replacement with no battery life and low resolution screen.

I currently am leaning towards swapping out any HDD for a SATA SDD, and put the HDD into the NAS and enable roaming profile + offline files for all non-video/music/picture files. I'd like to keep the mini PCIe slot free for WWAN which might be needed in future.

Another thing I'm wondering about:
The third generation intel Core Mobile CPUs support 32GB of RAM. Does that mean I can safely put 16GB DIMMs into any notebook sporting one of these processors?

[Umfriend]

There are 16Gb SO-DIMMs now? With 17" laptops I would expect 4 SO-DIMM slots.

Edit: At least 2nd-gen mobile i7s supported 4x8Gb already, not sure about i3/i5.

[dZeus]

There are 16Gb SO-DIMMs now? With 17" laptops I would expect 4 SO-DIMM slots.

Edit: At least 2nd-gen mobile i7s supported 4x8Gb already, not sure about i3/i5.

3rd generation i5 and i7 support 32GB of RAM (according to ark.intel.com for all the models I checked).

I haven't seen 16GB SO-DIMM modules yet, but I'm sure it's a matter of time. All notebook models I've investigated only have 2 SO-DIMM sockets max. This is currently not a problem, as the memory needs probably are in the 6GB area right now. However, I expect the usable life of the notebook to be at least 5 years, and by then 16GB or 32GB of RAM might be required for intended purposes.

[Jammrock]

3rd generation i5 and i7 support 32GB of RAM (according to ark.intel.com for all the models I checked).

I haven't seen 16GB SO-DIMM modules yet, but I'm sure it's a matter of time. All notebook models I've investigated only have 2 SO-DIMM sockets max. This is currently not a problem, as the memory needs probably are in the 6GB area right now. However, I expect the usable life of the notebook to be at least 5 years, and by then 16GB or 32GB of RAM might be required for intended purposes.

The DR replacement and workstation grade laptops have 4 SoDIMM slots. 4 x 8GB = 32GB

Last I check you must have a Core i7 to go 32GB in the mobile space, but that may have changed with Ivory Bridge. Use http://ark.intel.com to look up your proc options and verify before buying if you intend to hit 32GB in the future.

I would second getting an after market SSD. Buy the cheapest HDD you can get and grab whatever SSD you prefer. You can usually get a 512GB SSD for the cost of a 256GB SSD through the OEM.

Personally I've had good luck with HP laptops lately. We're getting EliteBooks for work and they are very nice. I've heard getting support through them can be a pain in the ass, and mileage in Europe may vary so...

Lenovo is a good way to go to get an inexpensive base build that you can upgrade after market. Just keep your original parts handy in case you need warranty work. OEMs don't like honoring warranties on equipment with after market parts.

[Umfriend]

Ah yes, when I advise aginst HP I mean the consumer space products. Elitebooks are a different story.

[UtwigMU]

why would you buy from ebay Germany? Are they much cheaper than the Lenovo online shop catered to your country? How does Lenovo deal with warranty across countries?

There is no Lenovo online shop catered to Slovenia. Distributors and resellers and they don't have all the models and no options to customize. For new models it's good but if you want used ebay Germany is best.


I mentioned this in case price is not best in France - you can always order the laptop from anywhere in EU and purchase AZERTY keyboard separately, while reselling original keyboard.


As far as Lenovo goes I never had problems with warranty if drives or memory were not original. Usually I brought my laptop in without HDD as I don't want anyone going through my data. Also warranty is worldwide. If your notebook is under warranty it doesn't matter where it's from. For example my brother's T61 is US origin and they replaced WiFi card under warranty with no problems.

[dZeus]

There is no Lenovo online shop catered to Slovenia. Distributors and resellers and they don't have all the models and no options to customize. For new models it's good but if you want used ebay Germany is best.

I mentioned this in case price is not best in France - you can always order the laptop from anywhere in EU and purchase AZERTY keyboard separately, while reselling original keyboard.


As far as Lenovo goes I never had problems with warranty if drives or memory were not original. Usually I brought my laptop in without HDD as I don't want anyone going through my data. Also warranty is worldwide. If your notebook is under warranty it doesn't matter where it's from. For example my brother's T61 is US origin and they replaced WiFi card under warranty with no problems.

The world-wide warranty is something important for her, which makes me tend to chose Lenovo. However, I've run into the following issues with the models I reviewed (L530, E530 and T530):

- The L530 does not officially support 16GB, while the E530 and T530 do. I'm afraid there might be a reason why this is the case, and unexpected problems maybe pop up when using 16GB or even 32GB in future.
- The E530 has many of its users complaining about 'pulsating fan' issues, which reminds me of my current Thinkpad T43 which has similar issues. I'd like to avoid noise issues at all costs. The lack of docking station connector is a minor annoyance.
- The T530 is incredibly expensive in Europe. In the US it's affordable, but in Europe it is €500 more expensive than comparable configurations of the E530 and L530, which puts it far outside of the desired price range. I'm afraid that when I import it from the US, the French customs will add more than just 20% VAT; if not, importing + buying a euro power cord and Azerty keyboard might be an option.

[UtwigMU]

LOL, you're like me: soldiering on with old Thinkpad while thinking of how to get girlfriend a new laptop.

[dZeus]

LOL, you're like me: soldiering on with old Thinkpad while thinking of how to get girlfriend a new laptop.

She's paying with her own funds, and I'd rather have her buy something worthwhile (read: not another Toshiba). Mind you, her current Toshiba is even slower/older than my Thinkpad T43; it's a Pentium Dothan 400MHz FSB on the Carmel platform. Opening more than 10 tabs on it in Google Chrome is a challenge for the patience-impaired.

On the other hand, I don't use my laptop that much, so I'm looking at a 128GB SSD (Crucial M4 slim) and Windows 8 Pro as an upgrade to 'rejuvenate' the Thinkpad T43 for another year or so. Its main defect is the non-acceleration of H264 video. I might get a Nexus 7 tablet for that purpose (I hope it has good video playback format capabilities for playing downloaded videos in mkv/mp4/avi/etc formats).

[Umfriend]

ABout tinkering with notebooks. How feasible is CPU-replacement? My H67 Express might just accept 3rd-gen i7QMs.