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  • Toyota acceleration: a short circuit

    Oops....they're in deep doo-doo now, especially since they've denied an electronic issue could be at fault for 3 years.

    ABC NEWS video story....

    Print story.....

    Expert: Electronic Design Flaw Linked to Runaway Toyotas

    Auto Professor Says Defect in Toyota's 'Fail Safe' System for Acceleration Creates Dangerous Condition


    A flaw in the design of Toyota's electronic acceleration system prevents the car's onboard computer from detecting and stopping certain short circuits that can trigger sudden speed surges, according to a professor of automotive technology, Dave Gilbert of Southern Illinois University's auto technology department.

    As a result, Gilbert told ABC News, the Toyota computers will not record an error code, nor will they activate the "fail safe" system designed to shut down the power and put the car in the "limp home" mode.


    "This is a dangerous condition, it is not fail safe," said Gilbert in an interview to be broadcast Monday on ABC World News with Diane Sawyer.

    "If there was this kind of fault, it will never set an error code," said Gilbert. As a result, he said, there will be "no fingerprints, no trail" when Toyota engineers inspect a car after an accident or incident of sudden acceleration.

    In a statement posted on its website Monday night, Toyota said confirmed it was aware of Professor Gilbert's concerns and was prepared to evaluate his car and his methods, inviting ABC News to be present.

    Toyota said what Dr. Gilbert demonstrated on ABC World News with Diane Sawyer appeared to be different than what he had originally described to Toyota's engineers.

    In its statement, Toyota said based on what it understood Professor Gilbert to have described, "unintended acceleration would not occur."

    Safety advocate Sean Kane, of Safety Research & Strategies, who first spotted the trend of owner complaints about "runaway Toyotas," says Gilbert's tests undercut Toyota's claims that its electronic system is not to blame for the sudden acceleration surges.

    "This is clearly an electronic problem," said Kane, who is scheduled to testify Tuesday before the House Commerce Committee on the Toyota issue.


    "The system is fallible, in fact, it's got some really troubling design strategies that are employed by Toyota that appear to be outside the norm. And their system clearly has design strategy that has a very slim margin of safety."
    Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 23 February 2010, 21:26.
    Dr. Mordrid
    ----------------------------
    An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

    I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

  • #2
    We have recieved the recall parts from Toyota, for the Pontiac Vibe models that were built by Toyota.
    They are a joke.
    They are a small slab of metal, maybe 3cm x 2cm (of varying thickness, there are 8 of them of different thicknesses).

    The tech takes that small slab of metal and shoves it into the pedal assembly.
    Basically, that little tab stops the gas pedal from bottoming out, where that rheostat can fault out, and spike (causing the unwanted accel).

    Total cost of recall....$0.37 in parts and like 3/10s hour in labor per vehicle.

    Fortunatley, the Pontiac Vibes never sold fer crap, so we shouldn't get plauged by too many of em...
    Core2 Duo E7500 2.93, Asus P5Q Pro Turbo, 4gig 1066 DDR2, 1gig Asus ENGTS250, SB X-Fi Gamer ,WD Caviar Black 1tb, Plextor PX-880SA, Dual Samsung 2494s

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Kruzin View Post
      Basically, that little tab stops the gas pedal from bottoming out, where that rheostat can fault out, and spike (causing the unwanted accel).
      ..
      Who in Hell designs a rheostat that doesn't have a stop before the rotor leaves the resistance track? WTF.....
      Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 23 February 2010, 22:57.
      Dr. Mordrid
      ----------------------------
      An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

      I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Dr Mordrid View Post
        ..
        Who in Hell designs a rheostat that doesn't have a stop before the rotor leaves the resistance track? WTF.....
        A major corporation more interested in profit margins than in consumer safety?

        Kevin
        Last edited by KRSESQ; 24 February 2010, 07:46.

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        • #5
          3 of Toyota's suppliers were raided by the FBI and DOJ last night.

          Link....

          FBI, Dept. of Justice raid US headquarters of Toyota supplier Denso in antitrust probe

          NEW YORK (AP) — The FBI raided the U.S. headquarters of three auto suppliers as part of an antitrust investigation, the agency said Wednesday.

          The FBI's Detroit office said agents raided the offices of Denso Corp, Yazaki North America and Tokai Rika. All the raids took place Tuesday evening.

          Justice Department spokeswoman Gina Talamona said the department is conducting an investigation of automotive electronics suppliers. It was unclear if other companies were involved in the investigation.

          "The antitrust division is investigating the possibility of anticompetitive cartel conduct," Talamona said in a statement. "We are coordinating with the European Commission and other foreign competition authorities."

          Denso spokeswoman Julie Kerr says the search of the company's office — which oversees Denso's operations in North and South America and is located in Southfield, Mich. — took place on Tuesday.

          Kerr said the company is cooperating with the investigation, but declined to offer details of what the government was looking for. Kerr said the investigation is unrelated to Toyota's recent recalls.

          A Tokai Rika spokesman also said the company would be cooperating.

          "We haven't done anything wrong. We'll supply them with all the information," said Joe Rine, a local spokesman for Tokia Rika, which makes interior components for Toyota, Ford Motor Co., General Motors Co. and Nissan Motor Co.

          A spokeswoman with Yazaki, which makes electronics for several automakers, said the company was drafting a statement in response to questions about the raid.

          A person familiar with the antitrust investigation said it involves possible discussions among the parts suppliers, not the safety of the parts themselves. This person spoke on condition of anonymity to be able to speak more fully about the matter.

          Toyota is Denso's biggest customer and is one of two suppliers of its gas pedals. While gas pedals from the other supplier, CTS Corp., were involved in Toyota's sticky-accelerator recall, Denso's have not been implicated.

          Toyota said in a statement that it was aware of the raids but has little information about the investigation. Toyota said it has not been contacted by authorities.
          Dr. Mordrid
          ----------------------------
          An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

          I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

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          • #6
            so no we are going from a played up recall to a media blitz to criminal lobbying to antitrust laws? gosh, somebody must have really been pissed about not getting a prius in time.

            mfg
            wulfman
            "Perhaps they communicate by changing colour? Like those sea creatures .."
            "Lobsters?"
            "Really? I didn't know they did that."
            "Oh yes, red means help!"

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