Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

NK missile did better than thought....

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • NK missile did better than thought....

    Oopsie....

    The first stage fired normally

    The second stage fired normally (previously not thought to have)

    The third stage didn't separate and fire, which ended the mission

    That all said: it nevertheless exhibited advanced steering never seen before on a NK rocket.

    Link...

    North Korean rocket flew further than earlier thought

    BY CRAIG COVAULT
    SPACEFLIGHT NOW
    Posted: April 10, 2009

    New details emerging from the analysis of data from North Korea's April 5 Taepo-Dong-2 test indicate the vehicle flew successfully several hundred miles further than previously believed and used more advanced steering than has been demonstrated by the North Korean's before.

    The rocket impacted as far as 2,390 miles from the launch site as opposed to about 1,900 miles as earlier announced by the U. S. and Japan.

    Smoke puffs from the side of the vehicle at the moment of liftoff and after, indicate the rocket could have been equipped with attitude control thrusters.

    It also temporarily flew in space before failing and dropping back into the atmosphere at relatively slow speed that enabled debris to survive till impact rather than burning up.

    The updated analysis indicates the failure occurred when the solid propellant third stage of the vehicle failed to separate properly after the second stage fired normally. After burnout the second stage coasted upward into space where the third stage was supposed to separate and fire, but did not.

    Earlier it was believed that the second stage had failed early in its burn.

    The rocket also demonstrated more advanced steering and other advances that could enhance its deployment as a silo-based ballistic missile.

    The Japanese Ministry of Defense and U.S. Defense Dept. now believe that the second stage of the rocket performed as planned rather than failing early in its flight phase.

    The new information comes from updated radar tracking calculations and possibly also U.S. Air Force Defense Support Program (DSP) missile warning satellite data.

    The bottom line is that the North Korean vehicle flew as much as 500 miles further over the Pacific toward Hawaii than U.S. and Japanese forces had announced initially.

    The new data now indicates that the second stage fell in the impact zone the North Koreans had earlier warned shipping and aircraft away from, instead of falling short of that zone as earlier indicated by the U.S. and Japan.

    The vehicle's second stage uses a Scud-ER (extended range) rocket engine that employs "step-throttling" in its propulsion to stretch the second stage burn duration to gain range and velocity.

    For the April 5 space launch mission the second stage was to use the same step-throttling technique, according to Charles Vick of Global Security.org. In years past Vick has provided accurate and detailed rocket analysis data to varied users, including the Congressional Research Service.

    The rocket performance data indicate that during the April 5 flight, the second stage did ignite after separation from the first stage, says Vick.

    The vehicle was flying in space at this time above 50 miles altitude, just above the outer fringes of Earth's atmosphere.

    Earlier data indicated that the failure occurred during this throttle-down sequence to as low as 65 percent thrust.

    But the new data shows the second stage performed this critical activity as planned, Vick told Spaceflight Now.

    The updated impact point was calculated from U.S. sensor data as the vehicle flew out of range of Japanese radars about 1,000 miles east of Japan.

    Details visible in the North Korean state television video of launch have also been analyzed further, turning up at least two major news issues on vehicle guidance and design.

    Smoke puffs from the side of the vehicle at the moment of liftoff and after, indicate the rocket could have been equipped with attitude control thrusters.

    This was not observed during the first Taepo-Dong-2 launch in 1998 and could indicate much more advanced steering capability than the rocket nozzle steering vane system used in the much more crude Scud launcher.

    The puffs jet from the side of the vehicle at where the second and third stages meet. The most visible puffs occur a split second before ignition (see picture above) and then again at liftoff. A Japanese enhancement of the video indicates that the puffs continue as the vehicle climbs out and pitches over to accelerate, says Vick.

    There are also indications in the video that the North Koreans added a structural covering over the entire third stage of the rocket once it was on the pad to form a constant volume outer diameter between the upper stage and the payload shroud.

    Earlier DigitalGlobe WorldView 1 commercial satellite imagery of the vehicle when it first arrived on the pad showed a more narrow upper stage with a bulbous payload shroud. The liftoff views of the vehicle show a constant outer diameter. Japanese enhancement of the imagery show the same changes, Vick said.

    Why the North Koreans would want to place an extra fuselage covering over the third stage could relate to vehicle aerodynamics or flight temperature extremes the upper stage may experience.

    But it would be much easier to install such a fairing before erection on the pad unless there were access ports to the satellite payload or upper stage used during pad processing that needed to remain open for access during early processing.
    Dr. Mordrid
    ----------------------------
    An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

    I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

  • #2
    I can't help but wonder...how we/they can claim it can be shot down, and beeing initially mistaken where it "landed" to the amount of 800km?

    Comment


    • #3
      Yes, i also find it hard to believe that they miscalculated by such a large margin...
      PC-1 Fractal Design Arc Mini R2, 3800X, Asus B450M-PRO mATX, 2x8GB B-die@3800C16, AMD Vega64, Seasonic 850W Gold, Black Ice Nemesis/Laing DDC/EKWB 240 Loop (VRM>CPU>GPU), Noctua Fans.
      Nas : i3/itx/2x4GB/8x4TB BTRFS/Raid6 (7 + Hotspare) Xpenology
      +++ : FSP Nano 800VA (Pi's+switch) + 1600VA (PC-1+Nas)

      Comment


      • #4
        Mainly because the impact was too far downrange for the Aegis's near NK to track it (over the horizon) and the downrange satellite IR tracking was a no-go because of the engine misfire and the low terminal velocity.

        Also; the Pacific basin is a big place and the missiles track was unknown prior to launch and its altitude relatively low, so placing a picket line of radar ships to provide full basin coverage wasn't possible - there aren't enough of them.
        Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 14 April 2009, 03:17.
        Dr. Mordrid
        ----------------------------
        An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

        I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

        Comment


        • #5
          ok now what?

          Comment


          • #6
            Elavate your fears. Forget about major recent frak-ups of "the elite".

            Comment


            • #7
              Well, the Russians have done something they haven't before - telling NK their launch wasn't "helpful". Doesn't sound like much, but strong words for them to use with a 'friend'.

              The tough nut though is China. They're in a bind.

              If NK's govt. collapses or a war starts they look to have millions of them streaming across the border as refugees and they don't want that. Support NK and you have this kind of nonsense, which puts them in a bind with SK, the US, Japan and everyone else in the region.

              Can you say Kobayashi Maru?
              Dr. Mordrid
              ----------------------------
              An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

              I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

              Comment


              • #8
                Now we know specifically why our post-launch intelligence was lacking....

                Link.....

                EXCLUSIVE: U.S. failed to use best radar for N. Korea missile

                Gates refused area commander's request


                By Bill Gertz (Contact) | Wednesday, April 15, 2009

                EXCLUSIVE:

                Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates denied permission for the U.S. Northern Command to use the Pentagon's most powerful sea-based radar to monitor North Korea's recent missile launch, precluding officials from collecting finely detailed launch data or testing the radar in a real-time crisis, current and former defense officials said.

                Jamie Graybeal, Northcom public affairs director, confirmed to The Washington Times that Air Force Gen. Gene Renuart, the Northcom commander, requested the radar's use but referred all other questions to the Pentagon.

                Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman said Mr. Gates' decision not to use the $900 million radar, known as SBX, was "based on the fact that there were numerous ground- and sea-based radars and sensors in the region to support the operational requirements for this launch."

                SBX, deployed in 2005, can track and identify warheads, decoys and debris in space with very high precision. Officials said the radar is so powerful it could detect a baseball hit out of a ballpark from more than 3,000 miles away, and that other radars used by the U.S. would not be able to provide the same level of detail about North Korea's missile capabilities.
                Dr. Mordrid
                ----------------------------
                An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

                I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

                Comment


                • #9
                  Interesting.
                  I wonder why.
                  Maybe using it would have given away classified info on it's capabilities to the Chinese.


                  Or, maybe Gates is trying to weaken the US on Obama's orders
                  Chuck
                  秋音的爸爸

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The Chinese are well aware of that radar and its capabilities, so either they're just clueless or what you suggested. Pick one.
                    Dr. Mordrid
                    ----------------------------
                    An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

                    I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      What, that thing's made in China too?!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I would have thought at the very least they would have a couple of AWACs in the area.

                        Kevin

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Nowhere View Post
                          What, that thing's made in China too?!
                          No, but every time they put something up that radar is giving it a real going over and RF signals being what they are the Chineses can analyze the signal at least as good as anyone else.
                          Dr. Mordrid
                          ----------------------------
                          An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

                          I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Oh, so suddenly its only "we wont turn it on in time and pointing it in direction Chinese surely know of"...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Or, maybe they took a look at the bog standard construction tower crane and tin shacks that NK used as a gantry and figured there was no point.
                              Chuck
                              秋音的爸爸

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X