So. Cal. Edison: 180k miles on LiION's

[Dr Mordrid]

Good news for PHEV's

Link....

Electric car batteries demonstrate 180,000-plus mile lifespan

December 3, 2008 One of the key points critics have leveled at the electric car movement is that any money saved by switching gas stations for the power point will be lost when the battery fades and needs replacing. With battery costs currently still high, this is a valid concern - but how long can a battery pack last? Battery provider Southern California Edison have been testing a lithium-ion battery subpack for two and a half hears now and have demonstrated a life of more than 180,000 miles without significant performance deterioration. Considering that the average American family car does less than 15,000 miles a year, you're looking at well over ten years' service from a battery pack before it needs replacing. Factor in your gas guzzler's scheduled servicing costs (negligible on an electric) and a fuel bill of more than USD$10,000 at today's low gas prices even if you drive a 29mpg small car, and it appears the cost equation is becoming more convincing for electrics.

As automakers work toward putting plug-in hybrid electric vehicles on the road, Southern California Edison (SCE) recently announced a major milestone in advanced battery performance.

Through ongoing evaluation and tests at its Pomona, Calif.-based Electric Vehicle Technical Center, SCE has demonstrated battery life performance equivalent to more than 180,000 miles in a commercial delivery van with minimal battery deterioration. These batteries could power tomorrow’s plug-in vehicles.

The battery test, conducted in a laboratory setting, uses a Johnson Control-Saft lithium-ion battery subpack that is one-sixth of the actual battery size used in a plug-in hybrid electric vehicle. The subpack has been tested continuously for two and a half years, and testing continues to monitor the battery’s remarkable performance.

Based on the results achieved with the battery pack, the U.S. Department of Energy has provided SCE with a full-size lithium ion battery and has asked SCE to test and evaluate the battery’s viability for passenger car application.

SCE is conducting the battery test in support of the Electric Power Research Institute’s (EPRI’s) evaluation of plug-in hybrid electric vehicles. The center evaluates all forms of electrodrive technologies for energy use, operating costs, efficiency, reliability, power quality, battery life, system impacts and safety.

[Gurm]

Still doesn't address the limited amount of Lithium available worldwide, and the lifespan of the battery. It's all fine and well to say you get 180,000 miles out of it over two years. Let's see it actually last 10. And yes, I know you've said the computer has a lot to do with it... I'll believe it when I see it. I have to replace my laptop Li-ion yearly, since its charge life halves every year.

[Brian Ellis]

I'll believe it when I see it. The article is so full of holes, you could drive a SUV right through them, quite apart from what Gurm correctly says. Suffice it to say that lab tests on a prototype battery will not reflect real-life conditions. Although heavier/Wh, NiMH have already proved their worth. Li-ion has not.

[Fluff]

Where does the Lithium go in a used battery? Is it recoverable / recyclable?

EDIT These guys can recycle.

http://www.toxco.com/processes.html

[Dr Mordrid]

There is enough Li for over 100 million LiION vehicles at about 12-16kg per, but long before that wall is hit other techs will have begun to replace them.

[Brian Ellis]

There saith the eternal optimist. Yes there is plenty of lithium in the world, but 99% of it is not economically exploitable. The "rogue" states of S America have you by the short and curlies for the supply! If, and it is still a big IF, Li-ion does become mainstream, then you can expect the price to triple - and it is already very expensive. You think a NiMH licence is crippling, you ain't seen nuffink yet!

And electric cars don't solve the carbon problem, they exacerbate it.

[az]

There is enough Li for over 100 million LiION vehicles

Wow! That'd last us nearly one and a half years if we all drove electric cars! In 2007, 73,152,696 vehicles were produced worldwide.

Source: International Organization of Motor Vehicle Manufacturers (OICA): World Motor Vehicle Production by Country: 2006–2007 (pdf)

[Gurm]

Yeah, current-gen electrics use precious metals, their manufacture has toxic byproducts, and... the electricity to drive them almost assuredly (in most areas, those within the Hoover Dam region or in safe nuclear power zones excepted) comes from burning fossil fuels. So making the car is worse for the environment than its traditional counterpart, and running it is too!