AVCHD Editing The Cineform Neo HDV Way

[Jerry Jones]

So you bought your first AVCHD camcorder and you're trying to figure out how to edit AVCHD.

Sony, Corel (formerly Ulead), Pinnacle, Nero all advertise relatively low-cost NLEs that they claim will allow you to get the job done.

Well, if your experience has been like mine, you are probably pretty frustrated by now.

AVCHD (and HDV) are known as a "long GOP (Group of Pictures)" formats.

On the other hand, DV .avi files are I-Frame format files.

I-Frame files are much easier to edit than long GOP files.

Long GOP formats are made up of frames that are not independent of each other and they require a lot of computer processor power to edit.

On my AMD Athlon 64 2.4 Ghz laptop, I can edit DV .avi files with ease.

But load my editor with HDV or AVCHD files and -- darn -- the computer not only gets bogged down, it turns out that the software that claims to be capable of natively editing long GOP with so-called "smart" or "minimal" rendering fails to work as expected.

With Corel and Magix software (based on MainConcept technology), for example, if you insert titles and then render your high or standard definition MPEG-2 files out to a single file on your hard disk, and then you playback the file, you'll see problems with the result: with Magix there's a glitch before titles and with Corel there's a glitch after titles.

It makes truly professional output impossible, in my view.

So I say why wait for a fix?

They've had years to get this working and they haven't delivered.

That's where Cineform -- http://www.cineform.com -- comes to the rescue.

Cineform sells a product for $250 that you can download and install.

I have three software video editors.

1. Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 11;
2. Corel (Ulead) VideoStudio 11 Plus;
3. Corel (Ulead) MediaStudio Pro 8.

After installing Cineform's "Neo HDV," I observe a shiny new codec option in each of the previously listed editors.

The bad news:

Transcoding long GOP formats to more edit-friendly I-Frame formats takes a long time and the transcoded files require a lot of hard disk space.

The good news:

Cineform is still worth it.

When you import the Cineform .avi files into the video editor of your choice, you'll notice it's about as easy to edit these files as DV .avi files.

Even my relatively slow laptop computer can edit the high definition Cineform .avis with ease and the quality of the previewing is fantastic.

Moreover, you can insert titles, transitions, filters and render out your timeline to a single high definition DVD file and then watch it playback FLAWLESSLY and the quality is great.

Cineform's download includes a utility called "HDLink" that I discovered I did not need.

"HDLink" is supposed to transcode long GOP formats to the more edit-friendly Cineform .AVI (I-Frame) format and you'll read on Cineform's Web site that you might need to buy a third-party software AVCHD player to be able to convert AVCHD files to Cineform .avi files.

Well, I discovered that I didn't need to use "HDLink" for that purpose.

As I mentioned, I have Corel (Ulead) VideoStudio 11 Plus, which features a built-in AVCHD decoder.

As I mentioned, I also have Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 11, which features a built-in AVCHD decoder.

So within each of those editors, you can simply drop an AVCHD file into the timeline and then render it out to a file on your hard disk using the Cineform encoder.

Since MediaStudio Pro 8 doesn't feature an AVCHD decoder, you can't insert an AVCHD file into the MediaStudio Pro 8 timeline.

However, you can import the Cineform .avi files into MediaStudio Pro 8.

So if you have Corel VideoStudio 11 Plus installed on your computer, you can use it to convert AVCHD files to Cineform .avi files.

Then you can bring the Cineform .avi files into your Corel (Ulead) MediaStudio Pro 8 timeline and edit in high definition with the greatest of ease.

The quality is terrific.

No long GOP MPEG-2 smart render bugs to worry about anymore.

Of course, the Cineform .avi files can also be created from HDV MPEG-2 files as well.

I think Cineform Neo HDV is well worth the money.

I formerly was a strong advocate for native long GOP editing.

But I have been unable to find a single non-linear video editor on the PC platform that works as advertised where long GOP native editing is concerned.

Perhaps Apple's Final Cut Pro works well; I don't know because I've never personally done any testing on the Macintosh platform.

Now I'm a convert.

Cineform .avi editing is the way to go for those of us on the PC platform who work with low-cost non-linear video editors.

The Cineform .avi files should also be easy to create from the source files of 720p camcorders such as the Sanyo HD2, the new Samsung SC-HMX10, the Aiptek Go-HD, and the Canon TX1.

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

One caution:

While I can get the Cineform .avi files to work in the Corel (Ulead) programs, I am having trouble getting the Cineform .avi files to work properly in Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 11.

But I'm working on that, too.

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 11 is apparently incompatible with the Cineform .avis.

In addition, the Pinnacle program -- after rendering AVCHD files to be Cineform .avi files -- seems to render them out as 32-bit (not 24-bit files) and these Pinnacle-created Cineform files don't seem to behave properly so I suspect Pinnacle isn't creating them properly.

So there seems to be an issue with Pinnacle not supporting this codec.

Beware.

But the Cineform .avis work great in the Corel (Ulead) VideoStudio 11 Plus and the Corel (Ulead) MediaStudio Pro 8 applications.

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net .A

[Hulk]

Jerry,

You are right the Cineform intermediary is fantastic. I experimented a lot with it a few years ago and found the results to be terrific from both a quality and performance standpoint.

Cineform is very tight lipped about the codec, actually they won't even call it that, but I did discover that it is an interframe format with extremely short GOP. Perhaps only 2 frames. As I said Cineform is not going to talk much about how it works.

I also got a chance to fool around with FCP at NAB 2005 and it was simply amazing with native HDV. So fast I thought they must have been using an intermediary. But the rep told me they were not.

[Jerry Jones]

Really!!

That's surprising because it behaves like an I-FRAME format; it's almost like editing DV .avi files.

In fact, you may recall how DV .avi files in Ulead (now Corel) MediaStudio Pro 8 appear in the timeline with those stripes that help you visually see how the smart render is working to render only those segments that are changed by titles, transitions and filters.

Well, the Cineform .AVIs behave in the same way and trigger those great stripes, which are visual cues that I have really grown to love over the years.

They smart render just like DV .avi files, too!!

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

Cineform is very tight lipped about the codec, actually they won't even call it that, but I did discover that it is an interframe format with extremely short GOP.

[Jerry Jones]

Hulk,

Not sure if your understanding of Cineform intermediate files is quite correct.

Apparently, they're actually wavelet files:

Q: What is the underlying compression technology used by CineForm Intermediate?

A: The CineForm Intermediate codec is based on a temporal Wavelet structure designed by CineForm for the rigorous visual quality demands required in a multi-generation post-production workflow. We also designed it for very efficient CPU implementation on PC architectures. The latter is why we have such very high performance - multiple real-time streams - while editing.

The word "temporal" means there is compression among successive frames, but MUCH more efficient than MPEG's notorious interframe coding based on motion estimation (we don't use motion estimation). Our temporal coding is so efficient that our codec is "symmetric", meaning that encoding and decoding take virtually the same amount of time. It's also why our render times are so fast.

Another interesting fact is that CineForm Intermediate is "blockless". What this means is that the image is compressed in one large "chunk". Although its blockless implementation is more complex, the simple reason we do this is for improved image quality. As most are aware, MPEG (and related algorithms) divide the image into small 8x8 block sizes, each of which is compressed individually and then reassembled upon decoding. In complex image sequences coded with MPEG you often end up with block noise and edge ringing contributed to by the small block sizes. This never happens with blockless Wavelet transforms.

Finally, our files are variable bit rate files for improved visual quality, not fixed bitrate. HDV is necessarily a fixed bitrate system because of the constant bitrate demands of tape recording. CineForm Intermediate compression allow bitrates to naturally rise in response to visually demanding scenes and fall during less demanding scenes.

Link: http://www.cineform.com/products/FAQ.htm#ProspectHD12

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

And in this thread...

http://dvinfo.net/conf/archive/index.php/t-53871.html

Cineform's own David Newman writes...

CineForm is effectively an I-frame wavelet codec. It is a lot lighter compressed than either HDV or DVCPRO-HD, as a result it is much higher quality for post production workflows. See info on quality here : http://www.cineform.com/technology/quality.htm

Fascinating.

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

With Final Cut Studio (which includes Final Cut Pro), Apple gives the user a choice.

You can edit natively with smart MPEG rendering of long GOP HDV sequences.

But this assumes you are a professional and you can afford the fastest Macintosh computer.

But Apple lets you also choose -- if you wish to do a lot of heavy-duty, multi-layer compositing -- to use a brand new Apple codec called ProRes 422.

This new ProRes 422 appears to be a new competitor -- by Apple -- to counter Cineform's efforts to establish itself on the Macintosh platform.

I hear the ProRes 422 codec is simply amazing, too.

Then, of course, the Apple consumer products ship with the Apple Intermediate Codec, which also performs quite well.

It seems to me the vendors of low-cost (sub-$200) non-linear video editing software on the PC platform have made a deliberate decision to short-change the consumer.

Good intermediate editing codecs are *not* included.



Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

I also got a chance to fool around with FCP at NAB 2005 and it was simply amazing with native HDV. So fast I thought they must have been using an intermediary. But the rep told me they were not.

[Jerry Jones]

Another thing I like about the Cineform workflow.

Mixed format timelines.

They're an increasing challenge.

The consumer camcorder market is changing dramatically.

The MiniDV format -- long the friend of the standard definition video editor with its edit-friendly, I-FRAME DV .AVI format -- is being replaced by camcorders that record to a variety of long GOP formats.

1. Sanyo HD2: Records to long GOP MPEG-4;
2. Aiptek Go-HD: Records to long GOP H.264 MPEG-4;
3. Standard definition DVD camcorders are numerous from all manufacturers and they record to long GOP MPEG-2;
4. High definition HDV (long GOP MPEG-2), high definition AVCHD (long GOP H.264/MPEG-4 variant), JVC's proprietary HD MPEG-2 hard disk Everio camcorders complicate the mix.

With intermediate codecs such as Cineform Neo HDV, you can take video from multiple types of camcorders and then conform their very distinct and different file properties to a single I-FRAME format whose properties never change.

Corel (formerly Ulead) came up with this new feature called "MPEG Optimizer" in hopes of overcoming the confusion over the project settings that one must choose when adjusting project settings and rendering out a mixed timeline; but -- in my view -- this isn't that great of an idea.

Why?

Because if you attempt to edit a variety of mixed format, long GOP files in a single timeline -- such as HD 720p MPEG-4 and HD 1080i MPEG-2 -- you will invariably run into the problem of system responsiveness.

By conforming all mixed format clips to a single, edit-friendly, DV-like format, you can edit with terrific ease in the timeline.

Moreover, the same visual cues that the editor has available in Corel MediaStudio Pro 8 -- such as those great timeline stripes that tell you which audio or video timeline segments require rendering... it all works with the Cineform .AVI files as it does with DV .avi files.

When one attempts to edit mixed long GOP formats in the MediaStudio Pro 8 timeline, however, the benefit of those visual cues is lost along with the ease of editing associated with I-FRAME format source files.

Long GOP editing is just an incredibly difficult thing to do because the engineers who designed long GOP codecs probably were not thinking about editors.

They were thinking about distribution.

With the Cineform .AVI files, you can render out to various formats such as HD MPEG-2 and WMV HD.

Keeping a "master" Cineform .AVI file is a lot like keeping a "master" DV .avi file.

In closing, I would also mention a couple of tips for those using the Corel (formerly Ulead) VideoStudio and MediaStudio Pro applications with Cineform.

Turn non-square pixel rendering "off" when creating your Cineform .AVI edit files.

(Uncheck the box).

They'll then have the proper aspect ratio.

Also... they're frame-based no matter which field order output setting you choose in Ulead.

So you might as well just choose frame-based.

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Hulk]

Jerry,

When researching for the book I spoke at length with David Newman and he is the one that told me CFHD uses a form of interframe compression. He would not go into further detail for obvious reasons.

[Jerry Jones]

That may be true, although the Cineform .AVIs and DV .avis (intraframe) also share I-Frame compression characteristics.

As Newman himself wrote in his post to the forum here:

http://dvinfo.net/conf/archive/index.php/t-53871.html

CineForm is effectively an I-frame wavelet codec. It is a lot lighter compressed than either HDV or DVCPRO-HD, as a result it is much higher quality for post production workflows. See info on quality here : http://www.cineform.com/technology/quality.htm

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

When researching for the book I spoke at length with David Newman and he is the one that told me CFHD uses a form of interframe compression. He would not go into further detail for obvious reasons.