Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Vista: ouch & double-ouch

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Vista: ouch & double-ouch

    Technology Review

    Uninspiring Vista

    How Microsoft's long-awaited operating system disappointed a stubborn fan.


    For most of the last two decades, I have been a Microsoft apologist. I mean, not merely a contented user of the company's operating systems and software, not just a fan, but a champion. I have insisted that MS-DOS wasn't hard to use (once you got used to it), that Windows 3.1 was the greatest innovation in desktop operating systems, that Word was in fact superior to WordPerfect, and that Windows XP was, quite simply, "it."
    >
    So you might think I would be predisposed to love Vista, Microsoft's newest version of Windows, which was scheduled to be released to consumers at the end of January. And indeed, I leaped at the opportunity to review it. I couldn't wait to finally see and use the long-delayed operating system that I had been reading and writing about for more than three years. Regardless of widespread skepticism, I was confident that Vista would dazzle me, and I looked forward to saying so in print.

    Ironically, playing around with Vista for more than a month has done what years of experience and exhortations from Mac-loving friends could not: it has converted me into a Mac fan.
    >
    Computerworld

    Windows development chief: 'I would buy a Mac if I didn't work for Microsoft'

    Microsoft's James Allchin made the comment in a 2004 e-mail to colleagues


    December 11, 2006 (Computerworld) -- Longtime Windows development chief James Allchin wrote in a January 2004 e-mail to Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer and company co-founder Bill Gates that the software vendor had "lost sight" of customers' needs and said he would buy a Mac if he wasn't working for Microsoft.

    "In my view, we lost our way," Allchin, the co-president of Microsoft's platform and services division, wrote in an e-mail dated Jan. 7, 2004. The e-mail was presented as evidence late last week in the Iowa antitrust trial, Comes v. Microsoft Corp.

    "I think our teams lost sight of what bug-free means, what resilience means, what full scenarios mean, what security means, what performance means, how important current applications are, and really understanding what the most important problems our customers face are. I see lots of random features and some great vision, but that does not translate into great products."
    >
    After this came out Allchin said that he was just trying to shake things up.

    IMO that sounds like someone who was candid, took hard shots and is backing down to save his bacon. That he "departed" after Vista was completed ads to that feeling.
    Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 30 January 2007, 12:03.
    Dr. Mordrid
    ----------------------------
    An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

    I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

  • #2
    context for the "I would buy a Mac" email.
    P.S. You've been Spanked!

    Comment


    • #3
      Did XP really seem that good when it first came out? Just seemed like a bubbly version of 2k. Now I absolutely love XP. Give Vista some time, I'm sure we will get to like it.
      Q9450 + TRUE, G.Skill 2x2GB DDR2, GTX 560, ASUS X48, 1TB WD Black, Windows 7 64-bit, LG M2762D-PM 27" + 17" LG 1752TX, Corsair HX620, Antec P182, Logitech G5 (Blue)
      Laptop: MSI Wind - Black

      Comment


      • #4
        CYA mode fully engaged

        Originally posted by |Mehen| View Post
        Now I absolutely love XP. Give Vista some time, I'm sure we will get to like it.
        I gave it time during the betas & RC's. Too much of it in fact.

        That's why we're migrating our non-editing/non-gaming desktops to Linux, and some of those have editing by way of MainConcept's MainActor 5 and Cinelerra.

        As for office apps there is OpenOffice 2.1, which far more than meets our needs.

        For graphics the list of good to great programs, 2D & 3D, is exhaustingly long.
        Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 30 January 2007, 12:47.
        Dr. Mordrid
        ----------------------------
        An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

        I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by |Mehen| View Post
          Did XP really seem that good when it first came out? Just seemed like a bubbly version of 2k. Now I absolutely love XP. Give Vista some time, I'm sure we will get to like it.

          Well, I somehow stick to win2k... Win2k3 actually ("forced" upgrade...apps/drivers/etc.), but it's conceptually very similar OS.
          And TBH the only thing that really interested me in Vista is using flashdisks to speedup loading times of OS & apps...which wouldn't help me much anyway (I suspect that performance penalty of Vista on my hardware would outweight speedups due to flash caching; and my computer/apps is basically always on anyway...)

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Dr Mordrid View Post
            CYA mode fully engaged


            I gave it time during the betas & RC's. Too much of it in fact. That's why we're migrating our non-editing/non-gaming desktops to Linux, and some of those have editing by way of MainConcept's MainActor 5.

            You'll be back - you can't escape M$.

            What's that old saying? - don't judge a book by its beta?

            Trust me, 2-3 years from now you will all be using Vista, and then when they start promoting the next OS you will all be saying - whats the point?, threatening Linux and Mac all over again. We've seen it happen with every MS release in the last decade+.

            edit: which isn't to say you should go and buy Vista now, wait a good solid year at least. edit2: actually I strictly recommend NOT BUYING vista for at least a year or so - drivers suck right now, games are slower, as are apps, but they will speed up in time.
            Last edited by Mehen; 30 January 2007, 12:38.
            Q9450 + TRUE, G.Skill 2x2GB DDR2, GTX 560, ASUS X48, 1TB WD Black, Windows 7 64-bit, LG M2762D-PM 27" + 17" LG 1752TX, Corsair HX620, Antec P182, Logitech G5 (Blue)
            Laptop: MSI Wind - Black

            Comment


            • #7
              ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz........... .......

              Yes, there are things we need Windows for. That's what dual/multi-boots are for. With XP now supported until 2014 (even M$ see's the writing on the wall) it'll take a "Vista-Only" tag on something I really need to get me to upgrade.

              That's likely to be a single Vista license for beta'ing, period.

              As for my wife: she loves the fact that her rig is so fast under Linux and has also transitioned her craft shop system to it. The more she uses Oo2's Paint and GIMP the less she uses Windows. Checking the logs she hasn't booted into XP for 2 weeks, the last time she reports using PhotoImpact-12. PI-12 and PrintMaster-17 are the only things she's using under Windows these days.
              Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 30 January 2007, 13:25.
              Dr. Mordrid
              ----------------------------
              An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

              I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

              Comment


              • #8
                If Vista was sold at a realistic price I think people would move over to it, mainly because support for XP will start to be phased out. As it stands with a retail copy of Vista costing more than a complete PC, which of course comes with XP, I'm expecting the queues of people waiting to buy it to be very short.
                When you own your own business you only have to work half a day. You can do anything you want with the other twelve hours.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Don't worry, 80% of Microsofts OS revenue will be on pre-installs so they are going to make their money and spread the OS out there like hot cakes soon enough.
                  But I don't think the enthusiats are dying to upgrade since it effects gaming performance (mainly on Nvidia hardware), and OGL games + ATI won't even run yet.

                  I have no choice but to upgrade to continute testing to ensure everything is fully functional etc.
                  We'll see how that goes.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Maybe, but I'm sure when HP etc. start shipping PC's with Vista on they will give you the option of installing XP instead, much like they did when XP came out.
                    When you own your own business you only have to work half a day. You can do anything you want with the other twelve hours.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      @Taz: II agree! 60$ for Vista ultimate would make me switch almost for sure.
                      Titanium is the new bling!
                      (you heard from me first!)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Vista Business from Insight is £245 (~$480), how can Microsoft justify that price. Sure most people will avoid retail copies and buy it OEM or as an upgrade but it's still overpriced. You also have to factor in the cost of hardware upgrades required to run it, I installed it on an Athlon64 3000+ with 512Mb RAM, which isn't exactly ancient, and it ran like a dog
                        When you own your own business you only have to work half a day. You can do anything you want with the other twelve hours.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          It ran like a dog, because you only have 512MB, and if Microsoft is saying Vista will run on 512, they are smoking some cheap S*&^.

                          You need a minimum of 1GB ram, just like you needed 512 just to run Windows XP, let alone apps.

                          I will upgrade my HP workstations to 4GB from 2gigs soon so I should be fine.

                          Also my laptop has 1gig and it runs VISTA Enterprise nicely with the odd hiccup, but my recommendation will be to upgrage to at least 1gig and you should notice a HUGE difference.

                          Cheers

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Elie View Post
                            You need a minimum of 1GB ram, just like you needed 512 just to run Windows XP, let alone apps.
                            Well yes I know that, I was testing it on a system that an average user would have to see how well it coped, the answer was not very.

                            It seems ludicrous to me that 1Gb of RAM is need for an OS, which is primarily there to allow you to run your applications. Microsoft can go on about added features and eye candy but to me it just shows totally inefficient coding. Maybe they need to be reminded that people manage to write whole chess games that run in 1KB of memory Atari, Commodore and Acorn managed to fit a GUI operating system in ~192KB. Sure Windows is doing more than they were back then but the extra requirements aren't comparative to the added features.
                            When you own your own business you only have to work half a day. You can do anything you want with the other twelve hours.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Elie View Post
                              just like you needed 512 just to run Windows XP, let alone apps.
                              That is not true, I run XP (yeah, I actually do ) on my old p3 laltop with only 384mb and it works just fine.
                              If there's artificial intelligence, there's bound to be some artificial stupidity.

                              Jeremy Clarkson "806 brake horsepower..and that on that limp wrist faerie liquid the Americans call petrol, if you run it on the more explosive jungle juice we have in Europe you'd be getting 850 brake horsepower..."

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X