Reality is Scarier than Fiction

[Brian R.]

This book will scare the crap out of you, even if you don't have children.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0465071732/qid=1134073494/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/103-0459866-2223040?n=507846&s=books&v=glance

[ZokesPro]

Aside from the fact that it scared the crap out of you, how was it? I read the negative reviews and they have some interesting replies.

[Brian R.]

I am still reading it.

The author provides transcripts of interviews she has had with many types of pedophiles, sadists, psychopaths, etc.

I had naively thought that child molesters were basically good people who had uncontrollable urges and fought them as best they could by staying away from children and situations which would contribute to their behavior. I also thought this thing was quite uncommon.

The evidence she presents from these interviews shows a quite different picture. The type of person who preys on children apparently has hundreds of victims. They choose to establish themselves as respectible and trusted members of the community, expressely for the purpose of gaining the trust of children and their parents. They are very manipulative and sneaky - and downright uncaring of what their behavior does to others. This does not even include the psychopaths who have no understanding of emotional responses by others.

The author began her counseling in a small community and found the rate of child abuse and predation was extremely high. She thought that she must have inadvertently uncovered a spot where these predators gathered. At conferences, she found that she was approached by collegues with similar occupations who told her that they had uncovered spots of extremely high incidences of child predation. This story became so commonly told to her that she realized that the incidence of this type of behavior was much higher than what was published in her reading.

Anyway, her interviews with the predators/pedophiles are amazing - and I'm only 1/3 of the way through the book.

From the reviews:
"As a police officer who's duties include juvenile, DARE, and School Resource Officer, I found this book to be right on target. Many times in my career you try to explain to parents what they need to to, be aware of, and watch out for. I feel this is a must read for parents and professionals alike."

"I'm a clinical psychologist and parent. Anna did a great job of blending her experiences as a professional, and a parent, to create a must-read.
Anna is a thorough fact checker and it shows. Great resource for parents, teachers, mental health professionals, and should be required reading for the Catholic Church hierarchy. If they are still in denial after reading this, there's no hope.
GREAT JOB ANNA."

[Dr Mordrid]

Since these predators have no possibility of being reformed IMO the solution is that the 1st offence = life or execution. Screw the bastards.

BTW: this is working its way into law in more than one state, and IMO given the number of such cases of late it'll spread fast.

Dr. Mordrid

[Brian R.]

I am firmly of the same opinion, from what I've read so far....

[Helevitia]

I don't think I could get myself to read the book. It would be too depressing for me.

[Brian R.]

Here is an excerpt from the book.

Warning - don't read it if you wouldn't read the book in the first place.

Recently I interviewed a psychopath. This is always a humbling exerience because it teaches me over and over how much of human motivation and experience is outside my narrow range. Despite the psychopath's lack of conscience and lack of empathy for others, he is inevitably better at fooling people than any other type of offender. I suppose a conscience just slows people down.

A convicted child molester, this particular one made friends with a correctional officer who invited him to live in his home after he was released-invited him despite the fact the officer had a nine-year-old daughter.

The officer and his wife were so taken with the offender that, after the offender lived with them for a few months, they initiated adoption proceedings-adoption for a man almost their age. Of course, he was a child molester living in the same house as a child. Not surprisingly, he molested the daughter the entire time he lived there. Later, when this was disclosed and the offender was reincarcerated, the guard and his wife continued to try to visit him in prison. They wanted to understand how he could do this. They wanted to see him. They were still attached to him. Even the offender was astonished by their behavior. He told his psychologist, "I feel like saying, 'What the **** is wrong with you, lady? I molested your ****ing daughter."

The saddest part of this story is that if this offender weren't tired of toying with the guard and his wife, he could easily do it again. All he would have to do is cry and feign regret, and in all likelihood the guard and his wife would shortly be advocating for the inmate's release with the parole hoard.

What these experiences have taught me is that even when people are warned by a previously founded case or even a conviction, they still routinely underestimate the pathology with which they are dealing.

Unbelievable

[agallag]

Since these predators have no possibility of being reformed IMO the solution is that the 1st offence = life or execution. Screw the bastards.

BTW: this is working its way into law in more than one state, and IMO given the number of such cases of late it'll spread fast.

Dr. Mordrid

I'm not sure I'd want them executed on the first offence. Castration, on the other hand... using two bricks... that's fine with me. On the second offence, if there is one after the castration, string 'em up.

[cjolley]

..invited him to live in his home after he was released-invited him despite the fact the officer had a nine-year-old daughter.
...

Sane people routinely underestimate how insane insane really is.
And over estimate how debilitating it is.

This creates ready victims for the insane predator.

[Dr Mordrid]

I'm not sure I'd want them executed on the first offence. Castration, on the other hand... using two bricks... that's fine with me. On the second offence, if there is one after the castration, string 'em up.

Castration doesn't affect these people as much of their thrill is psychological, not necessarily physical. As such there are many, many examples of offenders who have been physically or chemically castrated still molesting kids digitally etc.

Sick, but true and why I support life in solitary or, preferrably, execution.

Sane people routinely underestimate how insane insane really is.
And over estimate how debilitating it is.

This creates ready victims for the insane predator.

This kind of stupidity is why you see celebrities begging for founding members of the Crips to get clemency instead of getting the needle

Dr. Mordrid

[Wombat]

This kind of stupidity is why you see celebrities begging for founding members of the Crips to get clemency instead of getting the needle

The years can do a lot of things to a man. This particular man has been doing his part to prevent youth violence, and has even been in the running for the Nobel Peace Prize. The Bible is full of men who have redeemed themselves, why not this one?

[Dr Mordrid]

You're getting "spun".

All it takes to get a Nobel Peace Prize nomination is to have some wacko professor, judge or national legislator (ex: MP, congressman or senator) nominate the individual, and as you should well know many of either the education or legal/political caste are downright certifiable.

In the case of Stanley "Tookie" Williams it's been the same person, Prof. Philip Gasper of Notre Dame de Namur (Catholic) University in northern California, who has nominated him 5 consecutive times since 2000.

Prof. Gasper is a leading member of the Campaign to End the Death Penalty, so his efforts are less likely a true judgement of Williams "humanitarian" efforts than just using him as a politcal tool.

After Williams is worm-bait Gasper will move on to the next killer-with-a-heart

As for doing his "part"; all Williams has done is write the kids books, and it's not even clear if he actually wrote them of if they were ghost written.

When it comes down to the rubber hitting the road Williams has flat out refused to admit his part in the murders or to cooperate with the police in breaking up the Crips.

So much for Tookies "good deeds". Pffffftttt....

Also telling is that the 9th Federal Appeals Court, the most liberal in the nation, has turned down his appeal. This is the same court who treats every other liberal cause celebre as its own personal crusade.

Here's an enlightening article from the LA Times, a liberal paper, regarding the "difficulty" of getting a Nobel nomination;

Who doesn't have a Nobel Prize nomination?

By Eugene Volokh, Eugene Volokh is a professor of law at UCLA Law School.

MANY advocates of clemency for Stanley Tookie Williams note that he has been nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize and the Nobel Prize in literature for his anti-gang work, which includes writing children's books. How could a convicted murderer and co-founder of the Crips be nominated for such prizes?

According to Nobel Prize nominating rules, any "professor of social sciences, history, philosophy, law and theology" and any judge or national legislator in any country, among others, can nominate anyone for a Nobel Peace Prize. Past nominees include Adolf Hitler, Josef Stalin, Benito Mussolini and Fidel Castro. Any "professor of literature [or] of linguistics," among others, can nominate anyone for a Nobel Prize in literature.

Naturally, many nominees have real merit. But being nominated by one or a few of the hundreds of thousands of eligible nominators is little evidence of such merit. This is especially so when the nominee is a source of controversy, and when it may seem that nominating him may prevent his execution.

It would surely be helpful to readers if news stories mentioning Williams' nominations — or, for that matter, any Nobel peace or literature prize nominations — stressed how unselective the nomination process is.

We're used to prize nominations signifying relatively broad acclaim, as for an Oscar. When a nomination means nothing other than a recommendation from a professor (or even a few professors and a legislator), that should to be made clear.

Besides, a convicted murderer's nominations for Nobel prizes shed little light on the complex question of whether he is sincerely contrite, whether he has done good deeds and whether his life should be spared.

Dr. Mordrid

[Wombat]

In the case of Stanley "Tookie" Williams it's been the same professor, Prof. Philip Gasper of Notre Dame de Namur University in California, who has nominated him 5 times.

Check your sources, because they're wrong. His first nomination was by a member of Swiss Parliament.

As for doing his "part"; all Williams has done is write the kids books, and it's not even clear if he actually wrote them of if they were ghost written.

No, I'm not getting spun (though you're trying to spin things pretty hard). There's a lot of questions about the crime, and the trial. The prosecutor dismissed every black potential juror, and later went on to have two murders dismissed for using that tactic later in his career.

When it comes down to the rubber hitting the road Williams has flat out refused to admit his part in the murders or to cooperate with the police in breaking up the Crips.

Yes, that's called claiming innocence. Maybe he did it, maybe not. I don't care in this particular case.

So much for Tookies "good deeds". Pffffftttt....

Pfffftttt indeed. I like how you conveniently failed to mention the "Protocol For Peace," which has reduced gang violence greatly. Are you also saying that his books and public speeches have not had a positive effect?

Also telling is that the 9th Federal Appeals Court, the most liberal in the nation, has turned down his appeal.

Again, selective omission. The same court also urged Gov. Davis to commute the sentence. I also fail to see how the 9th is "most liberal." It is the most overturned (a fact that critics love to cite), but that's only by volume - they try more cases than the other districts, and percentage-wise they're in line.

Here's an enlightening article from the LA Times, a liberal paper, regarding the "difficulty" of getting a Nobel nomination;

That's not an article, that's an editorial - you may have even noticed the word "opinion" in the URL you followed. Volokh is a well-known libertarian writer.


Look, I'm not saying this guy is any saint, or that he should be freed. But for the last decade or so, he seems to have had a very positive effect w.r.t. youth violence. This man does more good for the world, now, alive than he would dead.

[Dr Mordrid]

The fact remains that one of the main arguements have been his multiple Nobel nominations, 5 of which have been by Prof. Gasper and only one by the Swiss MP. First, second....who gives a rip?

Editorial or not the info in that article is fact: all it takes to get a Nobel nomination is to have some qualifying wacko nominate you, which in this case means someone with a political axe to grind (anti death penalty) and a qualifying profession to spew from.

Anyone who doesn't see that the 9th Circuit is the most liberal in the nation needs a pin in their butt to wake 'em up. They don't get reversed so often because of their volume, but because of the content of their decisions. How else do you explain their coverage being only 1/6th of the nation by population but their representation in SCOTUS being almost 1/3rd of its cases?

In any case the California State Supreme Court just threw out another appeal by Williams this last week, and they most certainly are a liberal court.

I don't personally care if his speeches or writings (if his) have had a positive effect or not. If they're as good as stated then they'll stand on their own long after he's gone like any other author. IMO the finality of his execution would be a good exclamation point for them.

His crimes are legion and not limited to just those 4 murders, so as far as I'm concerned he's a prime candidate for being turned into worm food.

Dr. Mordrid

[ZokesPro]

@Brian: Do they talk about the child and what became of that child afterwards?