What Router?

[az]

We're moving, and will finally be able to use both our PCs at once, and naturally, we want them both be able to connect to the internet through DSL.

We have: 2 PCs w/ 100 MBit ethernet, one XP one 98SE (may upgrade to XP), one ethernet DSL modem.

We use: The web, POP email, ICQ (would be nice if file transfers worked, isn't absolutely necessary though), Overnet, WinMX, Games (mainly battle.net).

We want: To ba able to surf, mail, ICQ, chat, fileshare and play as if we were without a router (we also want to play on the internet together).

Bonuses:

- Cheap (we're quite broke, renovating and all)
- Easy to set up and use
- I don't know how good router firewalls are, if they're good, one would be nice, if it is easy to use and lets us play games without fiddling with it everytime
- Upgradeable to WiFi would be a nice bonus, as I don't know if I'm getting a laptop this or next year (Isn't absolutely necessary though, I imagine that these routers would be quite a bit more expensive)
- Traffic shaping would also be nice (Or is that a driver thing? If it is, compatibility with cFOS would be nice)

Thanks in advance

AZ

[UtwigMU]

Re: What Router?

Originally posted by az
- Cheap (we're quite broke, renovating and all)
- Easy to set up and use

Generally routers are cheap and cheap ones work. I have LevelOne FBR-1405TX 1WAN w/ 4LAN. Only problems I have is that the ECS K7S5A box with SiS LAN, sometimes - once per month or so - cannot access net (the Tyan Tiger box with 3COM LAN works fine), which a reset of router fixes. I also had a few problems with games (connection interrupted and LAG with 2 players from same net connection), which a firmware updated fixed.

The 3COM Office connect stuff has less features and costs 2-3 times as much as cheap Level1 or Linksys routers.

As for ease of use: Most are administered via browsers and are easy to configure.

- I don't know how good router firewalls are, if they're good, one would be nice, if it is easy to use and lets us play games without fiddling with it everytime

As for firewalls, on cheap routers in your budget range firewalls generally don't have a lot of options and making games work might be a problem. I only have option Firewall enable or Firewall disable, that's it. I have router firewall disabled and Kerio on boxes. Also firewall on router still won't catch trojans and phoning home software.

Other features:
Print server - unless you have a small company and/or print a lot, this is pointless and printserver routers have price premium
Number of ports - 4 ports is enough, if you need more, you can latter get a switch - 100Mb switches cost 5€ per port.
My router supports Adress Mapping (WAN IPs mapped to internal IPs) and port forwarding.

- Upgradeable to WiFi would be a nice bonus, as I don't know if I'm getting a laptop this or next year (Isn't absolutely necessary though, I imagine that these routers would be quite a bit more expensive)

You can latter purchase WiFi acess point (a wireless switch) and plug it into router. Personally I'd go that way and also WiFi is too slow for anything but basic surfing. The only use for WiFi in house I see is:
- you're lazy/unable to make every room have LAN
- you wan't to surf net while using the toilet and similar less usual places

- Traffic shaping would also be nice (Or is that a driver thing? If it is, compatibility with cFOS would be nice)

There is no such thing as router drivers. You enable DHCP on boxes and router, configure router to use PPPoE, set username and password for ISP in router administration, plug computers in and it works. You're online without any configuring uppon default WinXP install. Win98SE also works (enable DHCP, set default gateway to router), however personally I'd not have a 98 box online.

What I did was to set MTU that cFOS found to be best in router.


If you want more fancy features (better firewall, port forwarding better DHCP that assings IP according to MAC adresses, bandwidth limiting,...) you need a dedicated Win2k or Linux box with multiple NICS that acts as router. Even used box and couple of NIC's costs a lot more than dedicated 40€ router.

[rylan]

Linksys WRT54GS if you want wireless 802.11g. It also has a built in 4 port switch for lan. Around $115 US on pricewatch.

Linksys BEFSR41 for non-wireless, has 4 port switch. Around $50 US on pricewatch.

Of course I have no clue how expensive these are over there. They both have very nice configurable firewalls. I'm using the BEFSR41 at home on a couple differant PCs (98SE, XP) and it works great.

[GNEP]

I have the linksys BEFSR41 here. It works. Does everything I need (3 machines off the back of it to 1 ADSL connection, including a webserver). No complaints. So I would have no problems recommending Linksys. You can get ones that are upgradable to wireless too IIRC.

[gt40]

I'll put a vote in for Linksys - never had a problem with them, easy to setup, and downright stylish.

[spadnos]

I've got the BEFSR41 as well, connected to an ADSL modem.

It works great - most of the time.
(note that I've had this for years, so I probably have a VERY outdated hardware design - I know of at least two speed upgrades since mine was made). Lately, the router just stops routing packets. I have to go over and hit the reset button to get data to start moving again. This is pretty easy, and only takes a couple of seconds, unless the router is in a closet somewhere.

It accepts any client (there are no drivers) - I have connected Windows 98, Win2k, many Linuxes, a printer, and an SGI workstation, and all have worked flawlessly.

If you think you may want to have more machines later (like a network printer, etc), then the BEFSR81 isn't much more expensive ($80) and has 8 ports.

- Steve

[Wombat]

spadnos, have you upgraded the firmware?

[az]

I think the 4 port version will suit me just fine, and I don't think 45 EUR is too much. Any experience with non-standard protocols/ports in particular? (games, filesharing, etc.)

AZ

[Evildead666]

i have just bought a Netgear DG834G ADSL modem/router/firewall/ 802.11g/ 4 port 10/100 ethernet ports

the linksys version has the same specs and is cheaper.
i only noticed afterwards. its still a good deal tho, all in one, and really fast, no hassle, all DHCP..
i paid about 120euros but i saw the linksys here at around 82euros, which is about 80 bucks or so...

[Wombat]

I don't know if the SR41 does port forwarding. The SX41 does, that's what I have. You need it to make some un-NATable programs connect to one computer on your network.

Some things proxy well, and some don't. I know that BitTorrent can't be run by multiple clients behind a NAT. Games generally can. Instant messaging depends on with protocol you're talking about.

[GNEP]

On my SR41 I forward the incoming 6xxx port range to one machine which is used for bittorrents when we need to. Clients will still run on other machines but no where near as fast.

Port 80 is forwarded to my webserver machine.

All other ports are closed. I don't use the DMZ but have never needed to either.

So to answer Wombat's query - yes the SR41 does do port forwarding - up to 10 (IIRC) ranges to separate (if you want them to be of course) lan-side IP's.

[Jammrock]

go with Linksys. They've been around the longest, are now owned by Cisco, and they do the most for the money. Their new 802.11g line has "SpeedBoost" with reduces packet overhead and increases the data throughput.

Plus you can unplug the pre-installed antennas and put on your own. They use a standard F-type connector, so it's easy to find antenna's to boost your WiFi range.

Jammrock

[spadnos]

Originally posted by Wombat
spadnos, have you upgraded the firmware?

Yup. It's not the latest (1.44.2z or 1.45.7) - I have 1.43 now.

THe changelogs don't look too interesting, unless the out-of-order packet thing is screwing things up.

I'm not sure if the problem has been there from day 1, or if it's a recent development.

I haven't done a ton of troubleshooting (like letting Ethereal run for a few days or weeks, and checking the log when domething goes wrong)

- Steve

[Wombat]

I have 1.44, and it came out Nov '02. The 1.43 had some problems that made it a very bad choice for me. Can't remember what they were.

[spadnos]

Well - I guess I should upgrade and see if the problems go away.

Thanks
- Steve