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**Luco** · 13 October 2002, 09:13

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/okc_coverup.htm

Interesting theories there.....

"OO"

**SpiralDragon** · 13 October 2002, 12:44

isnt Jayna Davis am actris?

**SpiralDragon** · 13 October 2002, 12:46

you know i realy hope this dosent end up being another... American/European/Arab/Muslim bashing thread.... doc; if i did not know any better i would say you are putting up these posts on purpous to intimidate other ppl in this forum.....

**Joel** · 13 October 2002, 13:30

At least he is posting links to sites that are not purely let's bash the Arabs, anti-Arab sites. Unlike some of the purely anti-American site postings here lately.

Joel

**Dr Mordrid** · 13 October 2002, 17:41

Originally posted by SpiralDragon
doc; if i did not know any better i would say you are putting up these posts on purpous to intimidate other ppl in this forum.....

Not trying to intimidate anyone.

The fact is that the media in Oaklahoma City has been trying to get this story out since the bombings since they were able to make almost immediate connections beween Ramsey Yousef (found guilty of the first WTC bombing), the Abu Sayef organization in the Phillipines and Terry Nichols.

Now that more is known about the ties between Al Qaeda, Ramsey Yousef and Abu Sayef this begins to take on a whole lot more credibility.

Jayna Davis did a bang-up job investigating this and tying together a lot of loose ends.

FYI she was an investigative reporter for a network TV news department in OKC before leaving to pursue this full time.

There is a lot wrong with the *official* OKC bombing investigation as well. Lots of people find it very difficult to believe that a home-brewed ANFO (Ammonium Nitrate fertilizer + Fuel Oil) bomb in a truck parked on the street could have brought down that building. Believing this means belief in the idea that the truck explosion took out the supporting columns near the center of the building without taking out smaller columns between the truck and the supporting columns. That's kinda hard to buy.

I've used ANFO myself to blow stumps and boulders on the farm, so I know it pretty well. It doesn't posess the detonation velocity required to shatter reinforced concrete support columns of the size you would find in that building.

The reason is that ANFO has a detonation velocity of ~2500 to 3000 m/sec. This is fine for blasting stumps and blowing rock faces where the ANFO is in direct contact with the subject material, but it's not what you would use to blow a building from the outside. Any hope of destroying the inner support columns, which were over 100 feet distant and in the middle of a large surrounding structure, would require the use of something with a much higher detonation velocity and that it be much closer to them.

This is because of the inverse square law. Most wavefronts, be they shock or radiant, disperse so that their energy reduces inversely to the square of the distance. This means that the energy of the shock wave at 20 feet is 1/4 that at 10 feet and so on. Given the same frontal area on the part of the target by the time you get out to 100 feet it has lost a lot of its original punch. Not to mention that absent it being a shaped charge the building would have only been exposed to about 15-25% of the total blast from the bomb to begin with.

That level of detonation velocity IMHO would require an explosive like C4 or Semtex, which you just don't get at the feed store like you do ammonium nitrate, and even then they most likely would have had to be planted inside the structure. Most likely those charges were attached to or very near the buildings supporting columns.

This would present the need a much more sophisticated plan and much better funding; more suited to an ops team than a pair of guys who supposedly had trouble getting their 10-20 pound test bombs to explode at Terry Nichols farm just a couple of weeks before the attack. The truck bomb they ended up using is estimated to have weighed over 4000 lbs.

That brings up another troubling issue: that the bomb in the OKC bombing truck was sophisticated enough not to exhibit the fratricidal problems associated with large ANFO bombs. This means that unless they are professionally designed and have sophisticated triggering mechanisms they tend to blow themselves up before all the explosive is detonated, thereby drastically limiting their yield.

Such timing mechanisms are often used in the large car and truck bombs used by middle eastern terrorist organizations.

Then comes the problem of correctly shaping the charges to get most of the blast going in one direction. Again; this from a couple of neophyte bomb makers? Hmmm......

Dr. Mordrid

**GT98** · 13 October 2002, 19:08

Doc,

You scare me sometimes with some of the stuff you post here

**Dr Mordrid** · 13 October 2002, 19:28

Just one of those folks who grew up using explosives to clear fields....plus a few years studying physics and chemistry.

PS: did I ever tell you that I'm also moderately proficient with several primitive weapons? Bow (long, recurve, compound & cross), boomerang, sling and bola. Even tried an atlatl (spear thrower) a few times. No, you don't just throw a spear with your bare hand as shown in cartoons & old movies

Be afraid....very afraid

Dr. Mordrid

**Rakido** · 14 October 2002, 00:03

Dr M., that's you on the pic?

Rakido

**RichL** · 14 October 2002, 06:02

Originally posted by Dr Mordrid

There is a lot wrong with the *official* OKC bombing investigation as well. Lots of people find it very difficult to believe that a home-brewed ANFO (Ammonium Nitrate fertilizer + Fuel Oil) bomb in a truck parked on the street could have brought down that building. Believing this means belief in the idea that the truck explosion took out the supporting columns near the center of the building without taking out smaller columns between the truck and the supporting columns. That's kinda hard to buy.

I'm not familiar with the specifics, but over here some chaps from the IRA have used trucks full of fertilizer based explosives before to considerable effect on large buildings.
Its not 100% impossible.

**Dr Mordrid** · 14 October 2002, 07:55

Nope, that's not me

That doesn't explain why large reinforced concrete columns in the center of the building were shattered while smaller columns half the distance to the truck survived...and not just a few of them.

Many people here strongly suspect that the investigations were somewhat fishy. The Clinton appointees to the Justice Dept. and Attorney Generals office did everything they could to turn the investigation away from external resources for McVey and Nichols and to define the OKC bombing as internal terrorism. Problem is they couldn't hide the money and travel trails that led overseas. This drove the career investigators nuts, but.....you can figure the rest.

Why? Dunno, but these are the same people who when offered Usama Bin Laden on a silver platter by the govt. of Sudan in 1996 declined to take him

Dr. Mordrid

**SpiralDragon** · 14 October 2002, 10:40

big deal... i fence... arch... spear.... and love to use broadsords and dagers.....

no but seriously..... you are a dangerous person doc......

i will tell you this the first time i heard about the MURC one thing came to mind; MURC?? for mercinary??? so you intreted in a litle job

need to blow up on big F***ing A$$ hole........

oh wait a minut now i get it... Matrox Users Resource Center...

nerver mind that.... you intreseted in the job any way ... help a felow murcer get rid of a bad a$$ person ... pwuity pwees...

any way .. on a serious note.... i hope that who ever is responsible for this and any other killing should roast in hell........

**Dr Mordrid** · 14 October 2002, 20:50

Roast? Nope....a nice, slow broil on a spit is better

Dr. Mordrid

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Iraqi Army - Oaklahoma City bombing ties?

Iraqi Army - Oaklahoma City bombing ties?

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