Time for crow pie!

[Rags]

I remember reading this:
"You might feel that the air war is justified - I dont. If the US really wants to destroy binladen or the taliban they have proved that they wont do it from the air. A report on the BBC news today stated that the put the Taliban casulties at 'the low hundreds' the US dont have anymore targets to bomb. Ground troops will be required. Will the US stand for bodybags? I dont think so.

Lets be honnest here - It doesnt look like the current tactics are working. "
from a certain member. Let's be honest. Someone needs to eat some crow

Rags

[Dilitante1]

What has me nervous now..

is on the news late last night there was talk of after getting Bin Laden, of going after those who supported him like Sadaam Hussein.....I dont think the coalition countries will go for that as the Middle East has already flared up since we started bombing for Bin Lamer.............


-pickle

[Rags]

Re: What has me nervous now..

Originally posted by Dilitante1
is on the news late last night there was talk of after getting Bin Laden, of going after those who supported him like Sadaam Hussein.....I dont think the coalition countries will go for that as the Middle East has already flared up since we started bombing for Bin Lamer.............


-pickle

We can only hope we get something going in Iraq to get Hussein out.

Rags

[Helevitia]

Re: Re: What has me nervous now..

Originally posted by Rags

We can only hope we get something going in Iraq to get Hussein out.

Rags

I second that!

Dave

[KvHagedorn]

Lets be honnest here - It doesnt look like the current tactics are working." from a certain member. Let's be honest. Someone needs to eat some crow

Cmon Rags, not going to name and shame?

is on the news late last night there was talk of after getting Bin Laden, of going after those who supported him like Sadaam Hussein.....I dont think the coalition countries will go for that as the Middle East has already flared up since we started bombing for Bin Lamer.............

The only thing we have to fear is fear itself, Dil..

If we hadn't given in to the wishy-washy lily-livered fools who objected to us going all the way to Baghdad 10 years ago and destroying Hussein's regime, the twin towers would probably still be there. Thats what we get for listening to weak minded people. If we listen to them now we can expect more of the same. Do you want that? If these folks are afraid to stand up to Iraq, why should WE assign any worth to their opinion? They have no brains and no guts and don't have anything worth threatening us with.

[RedRed]

Rags

I posted that....

and it was posted before the b52's went in.

and yes, presision bombing would not have worked its why they had to use the heavy bombers....

I believe that they (b52's) are imoral, indescrimiante, and have caused god knows how much carnage (not just to 'enemy' troops). There dont seem to be the same 'bombsight video' for that.... there are plenty of pictures of unexploded cluster bombs lying around the country....

As to the coalition supporting the US on attacking other countries...

Britian might (though several forein office ministers have come out against further involvement, unless it can be demonstrated that the harbour Al quada)
Most of Europe wont, and have said so. (most are now refusing to cooperate with this dangerous 'no trial' courts the US is running (see Portugal last month)

Regards
RedRed

[RedRed]

If we hadn't given in to the wishy-washy lily-livered fools who objected to us going all the way to Baghdad 10 years ago and destroying Hussein's regime, the twin towers would probably still be there. .

Ba**ocks

Thats what we get for listening to weak minded people. .

Just because some people (even some US citizens) dont like the idea of the US bullying the rest of the world, does not make make them mentally inferior to you.

If we listen to them now we can expect more of the same. Do you want that? If these folks are afraid to stand up to Iraq, why should WE assign any worth to their opinion? They have no brains and no guts and don't have anything worth threatening us with.

Why should we assign any worth to your opinion either? Oh I forgot, you have a bigger gun!

RedRed

[KvHagedorn]

I believe that they (b52's) are imoral, indescrimiante, and have caused god knows how much carnage (not just to 'enemy' troops). There dont seem to be the same 'bombsight video' for that.... there are plenty of pictures of unexploded cluster bombs lying around the country.

Isn't that sad? Boo Hoo.

Britian might (though several forein office ministers have come out against further involvement, unless it can be demonstrated that the harbour Al quada) Most of Europe wont, and have said so. (most are now refusing to cooperate with this dangerous 'no trial' courts the US is running (see Portugal last month)

Oh, well. As if we need their permission..

Wake up and understand the world.. civilization is for peacetime. In wartime it gets you killed because you CHOSE to be WEAK. I don't want those damned terrorists running loose just because of some legal technicality. You seem to care more about the rights of these suspected terrorists than you care about the innocent lives they would take.

"Daddy, why did Mommy get blown up at work?"
"Because the government is run by weaklings, honey."

If I were president, I would put up with all the liberal whining in the world to prevent this sort of conversation from taking place, and I feel pretty sure that George W. has his priorities similarly in line. Thank God Gore didn't win his whine campaign. We would be sh*t outta luck then.

[KvHagedorn]

Red, if we had pussyfooted around and not used B52s and ground troops, the war would probably still be going on and nothing would have been accomplished. You either fight back or you die in this world, and it is because of the perceived weakness in the West put forth by those such as yourself that people like al quaida see us as an easy target. You seem to think we are somehow exempt from the laws of nature. We are NOT. If we choose to be strong, we can continue our lives; if not, we will be overrun, just as the sick of the herd get weeded out by lions. This is just the way things work. Deal with it.

And for your information, the size of one's "gun" doesn't matter unless you are ready to use it when you must.

[RedRed]

"Daddy, why did Mommy get blown up at work?"

I am sure that many afghans said that over the past few weeks...

Wake up you!
You are not really at war!


The US is not in danger, there has been no formal or informal declaration...

George Bush jnr is looking to better daddys play in the gulf last time round...

ah as for some 'legal technicality' - thousands of people are currently being held NOW in the US without trial, access to a lawyer, even a bloody judge! The maximum sentence these kangaroo courts can impose is DEATH!
http://www.wired.com/news/conflict/0,2100,48443,00.html

specifically on page 3

The American Civil Liberties Union says: "To our knowledge, the move to establish a military tribunal when Congress has not declared war is unprecedented. We do not believe that the administration has shown that the constitutional jury trial system does not allow for the prosecution of those accused of terrorist activities."

http://www.wartimeliberty.com/articl...39&mode=thread

specifically:
"[On September 11, 2001,] our fellow citizens, our way of life, our
very freedom, came under attack in a series of deliberate and deadly
terrorist acts. . . . America has stood down enemies before, and we
will do so this time. None of us will ever forget this day. Yet, we
go forward to defend freedom and all that is good and just in our
world."

--President George W. Bush
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/09/20010911-16.html


"[A]s we respond here at home to what we learn from these attacks, is
that this is a country that understands that people have fundamental
God-given rights and liberties and our government is constituted to
protect those rights. We cannot -- in our efforts to bring justice --
diminish those liberties. Clearly this is not a simple, normal
criminal case. This is an act of war, and those rules of warfare may
apply. But here at home and domestically, we need to make sure that
we're not tempted to abrogate any civil rights such as habeas corpus,
protections against unreasonable searches and seizures, the freedom of
expression and peaceable assembly, or freedom of religion. And just
because somebody may come from an ethnic background, that means
nothing in the exercise of their rights as citizens. They are American
citizens. And so let's make sure that in our anger and in our efforts
to bring justice, we remember our basic foundational civil liberties
and not abrogate them."

--Senator George Allen (R-VA)
http://allen.senate.gov/PressOffice/FloorStatementOnTerroristAttacks.htm


"Some have said yesterday and today that all has changed, all has
changed for America. I know what they mean by that, and I respect
their view, but I pray that is not true. I pray that is not true. I
pray my junior colleague from Virginia is correct when he says the one
thing we cannot allow to change is the values upon which this country
is built, for if that were to occur, then they would be able to
declare victory, genuine victory."

--Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. (D-DE)
http://biden.senate.gov/%7Ebiden/press/release/01/09/2001912907.html



regards
RedRed

[Rags]

Originally posted by RedRed
Rags

I posted that....

and it was posted before the b52's went in.

and yes, presision bombing would not have worked its why they had to use the heavy bombers....

I believe that they (b52's) are imoral, indescrimiante, and have caused god knows how much carnage (not just to 'enemy' troops). There dont seem to be the same 'bombsight video' for that.... there are plenty of pictures of unexploded cluster bombs lying around the country....



Regards
RedRed

I know who posted, and you never said that we would be able to win without going in with a ground assault.

Red, do you even know what the B52's carry? Do you know where the B52's were bombing? Do you know what they were bombing with? I didn't think so.

Rags

[RedRed]

kv
I never said that the US was weak.

you inferred that one had to be mentally inferior to disagree with the us. I dont think so. There is no country materially or militarially stronger than the US. You said that countries were afraid to stand up to Iraq... what has it done? Since it was beaten the last time, I mean? WHY should the US unilaterally attack another soverien state, even if you dont like its politics or its methods. It hasnt attacked the US, as far as we all know....

Red, if we had pussyfooted around and not used B52s and ground troops, the war would probably still be going on and nothing would have been accomplished.

Until Binladen is in the ground or an trial, it HAS achieved nothing!

All that has happened is that a few more thousand tons of unexploded munitions are scattered over afghanistan. several thousand people are dead. one coprrupt reigime has been replaced by another.

RedRed


RedRed

[KvHagedorn]

Just because some people (even some US citizens) dont like the idea of the US bullying the rest of the world, does not make make them mentally inferior to you.

Why don't you make a reasoned argument supporting your claim that we are bullies? This is just a bunch of rhetoric, an Orwellian "big lie" if you will. Just keep repeating it and it is true. Bollocks right back on that one. Just because we fight back when attacked us doesn't make us bullies. It means we have character and are not a bunch of spineless, weak kneed, whining victims. We throw our weight around sometimes when the situation demands it, but it is usually to address some grave injustice being done, and isn't even remotely close to the way Britain threw its weight around between the reigns of the two Elizabeths. Maybe we SHOULD do that, and really give you something to cry about.

[KvHagedorn]

you inferred that one had to be mentally inferior to disagree with the us.

Here is exactly what I said: "Thats what we get for listening to weak minded people. If we listen to them now we can expect more of the same."

I did NOT say that one had to be mentally inferior to disagree with the U.S.

[RedRed]

kv

I was only quoting back at ya what you were saying.... you go talking about being at war and being strong... America hasnt named its enemy, its named a concept.

It claims to be fighting (but not to have declared war on) terrorism. Proposing to attack a country to 'finish the job' is bullying.

rags
I said that I had posted, only because someone else asked!

A b52 carries Lots of dumb bombs, it showed the 'diasy cutter' in action
a 15,000 lb bomb. dumbfire, dropped by parachute drouge.... (can be inaccurate by up to 2 miles!!!)

http://www.safaridave.com/pics6.shtml

Main targets were:
front lines, villages cities (kabul, Jelalabad, Kandahar, and the like, its was on the bloody BBC!