Haig Is it Hopeless? G200-DVD daughter and SS7

[Bixler]

Forgive in advance if you've answered this question, but I haven't found any recent posts on the ongoing Zoran/DVD Daughter Card issue.

Your second level Tech Support was VERY attentive and helpful with my installation problems, (Alex, I think) and I have found a way to make the DVD Decoder Card work on my system, but not very well--(basically a version of a dual boot)

He kindly suggested that I request a refund. (I'm not being sarcastic)-- he was really sincere, but I just can't bring myself to believe that you guys are going to abandon us poor hapless Marvel G-200 guys. I need some honesty or else some good advice. The tech I was working with couldn't get into evaluations of "Which MB is Best." I understand that from an ethical standpoint. You've got to get along with everybody out there in the hardware world (or try), but it is time for some honesty and answers on the issue of the Hardware DVD Decoder/Zoran mess.
I know you guys got hosed by ZORAN, and that's unfortunate--but there is a way to make this stuff work, you just gotta want it. Your solution to DVD Decoding is the right way (at least in concept) to do this on a PC. Any one wanna argue??

Any of you MURCers out there wanna advise on a MB/Chipset/processor combo that works BEST with a Marvel G-200, if Haig can't offer advice?

Here's the question. Is there a Motherboard/chipset/configuration that has been tested, and is KNOWN to function properly with the Marvel G200 TV and DVD daughter card? I'm considering a MB upgrade anyway, but I would like, if possible, to solve this DVD Decoder thing at the same time.

IF YOU REALLY MEAN IT, I'll apply for an RMA on your recommendation--but if there's hope I can be patient.

An Honest assesment of the Driver update issue would also be appreciated--Are we stuck with 4.33 forever??

System specs below. Original issue with your tech support was a consistent bombout or lockup each time the Zoran software was called. Matrox Technical Support case 45687

Thanks for paying attention--I've enjoyed lurking around in this forum and watching how it works. Boy what a masochist some of these people are (referring to 'madman').

If you care to engage in a few exchanges on this thread about customer support, I would like to have a calm, honest exchange, or perhaps you would recommend another forum for that.

------------------
AMD K6II 333
on SOYO SY5EMA
128 K 8ns PC100 SDRAM
Marvel G-200 TV
w/DVD HW Card
Promise Ultra 66 PCI/IDE
Win 98--running 98 Lite
(A GREAT program)

[Zwisch]

Hi Bixler,

Have you tried putting the DVD-ROM on your promise card? I heard that this works in these situation without creating a seperate hardware profile.

Let me know!

Z

[Ant]

I ran my Marvel G200 + DVD hardware add on on a PII 350/ABit BX6 motherboard with no problems at all.

[Zwisch]

Ant,

The problem here if I remember from his previous postings was the presence of the Promise card and, maybe, SCSI...

I had the same problem on my older SCSI system...

Z

[Bixler]

To the config. suggestions--Thanks, but, been there, done that. My promise card is recognized as a SCSI (go figure!), and the Zoran interface just won't allow it. But Hey! thanks for trying. I have suspected all along that most of these problems relate to SS7/AMD boxes and busmastering--Am I right? I'm leaning toward a BX/PIII, but that's why I asked the question.


Bingo Zwisch!

I've been deep enough into this that Matrox has acknowleged that the underlying problem is theirs. It's just frustrating that there doesn't appear to be any progress on a real fix. I'm one of those optomists/obsessives that can't believe there isn't a true technical fix for the issues that Matrox has (to their credit) acknowleged.

Haig--I've watched your posts on other problems, and I appreciate the situation that you are in. If Marketing or Operations won't let you say or do certain things I understand that--I'm in business too. But I can tell you are trying, and your presence in this more informal setting helps Matrox immensly. That's one of the reasons I don't want to give up.

Thanks Guys--I'd like some more lengthy suggestions on Configs that work.

[Zwisch]

... but have you tried putting your DVD-ROM as primary on your promise card? But still be sure that it is the first letter for any CD/CDR or DVD drives...

Z

[Bixler]

Hmmmm...an interesting trick! I'll try when I get the time and see what happens. Forgive if I tossed off your suggestion, but no kidding, I've been through so many different cabling/lettering setups trying to scattergun through this that I really do believe that I probably did.--It's worth a try.

Would you mind explaining to a somewhat technically minded novice how this might overcome the problem? In spite of the frustrations (THINGS SHOULD WORK!) I've learned much about the arcane world of PC hardware. I'm genuinely curious!

[Bixler]

...and what's a MURCette??

[Bixler]

Zwisch (and Ant)

Tried the fix you suggested--Carefully--
Then tried again with DVD as Secondary master on the promise.

No Joy.

When DVD was secondary--the system froze instead of completely resetting--but the results are the same. Power Button reset was the only option.

Both tries were with DVD as E: (the first of two removables) C: is bood drive and D: is another storage HDD F: is a CDRW.

What works currently is this: Second Hardware profile.

NO Promise card (therefore no CDRW OR Second HDD)

C: Primary Master IDE (no Slave)

DVD configured under second Hardware Profile as D: (Zoran set not to search)

OEM Win 98 Busmaster Drivers--the Via 4 in 1's don't work--same symptoms as above (I've tried both)

Check my other HdWe in the first post...

Any other Ideas? I'm numb, and harmless, and will follow all instructions to the detail.

[Zwisch]

If the CDRW is not on the promise card, does DVD word? If so then two things to try :

1. try DVD as sec Master and CDR as sec Slave

2. put the CDR on the normal IDE port, and not the promise...


Z

[Rags]

How about puting that Promise card in a different slot, the SS7 chipset you are using is likely to have only certain slots that will allow busmastering, look on soyo's website to see which slots support BM, and use it.

Rags

[Haig]

Hi Bixler,

I'm game for a calm exchange, but I would be more interested in the Technical Support Dep't. Any type of constructive criticism towards customer service or any other dep't, I can cut n paste our exchange and send it off to them. We can keep it on this thread or a new thread if you wish.

Now for Zoran module.

Officially speaking, Technical Support will only provide support for this module and the 4.33 display drivers.

It will somewhat work with PD 5.25 but certainly not with PD 5.3x. I really don't want to sound like I'm passing the buck but here's what we are faced with.

There are 2 problems with the module and PD 5.3x. There is a playback problem and a region code change problem. We have fixed the playback problem with PD 5.4x but there is no way for us to fix the region code change problem. This region problem will allow you to play in one region only. We are currently pushing these guys to get us a patch but as you know, it isn't too easy since we didn't bundle their app with the G400 cards.

We are also looking into this internally to see if there is anything we can do about it, but so far, nothing has surfaced.

I am hoping for some kind of definite response to give to our clients but don't know when that will be.

If there is a definite official fix, I seriously doubt that we will keep on "officially" supporting it with future PD updates unless the problem is an easy fix within the display drivers.

I am aware of the exchange between you and Alex and there's nothing more to say but to be patient until there's some kind of definite response.

The only definite thing about Zoran is that we will be releasing a patch for the softDVD which had region change problems with PD 5.xx. I know I've been saying this for ~ a month but it is coming.

For your motherboard, I can only tell you this from personal experience. Here's my home system's specs where I had no problems with a Marvel G200. I now use a G400/RRG:

- PII 400
- 128m (PC 100)
- 300w power supply
- CD Rom (IDE 2 slave)
- CD Burner (IDE 2 master)
- Quantaum Fireball EL5.1G (IDE 1 master)
- Two Quantum Fireball EX 10.2G (Promise FastTrak)
- Gina Audio card
- Voyetra Midi Interface
- Win98 (1st edition)
- HP Deskjet
- P2B-F

Haig

[Bixler]

Hey Rags & Zwisch!!

I'll give those two options/suggestions specific tries, but have to say off the bat that I don't believe there is ANY physical combination that I haven't tried. No kidding, I'm one of those fools who can't let go until every combination has been tried, and I believe I have. My own best guess is there are about 150 permutations of cabling, driver and card options on my system, and I've tried them all. (think about it---5 minutes per reboot!!! do the math.) However, having said that, (and enjoying the entertainment of the madman threads), rest assured, I will follow your suggestions to the letter and report back. It really looks like Promise/Via/Matrox is not a workable combination, or we've got another SS7 busmastering bug that is endemic, and just shows up when High performance is needed.

Rags--I KNOW that I have tried the Promise card in both of the first two slots below the agp--and it currently is in the 2nd slot. I'm aware of, (although I don't fully understand) the quirk with VIA, AGP, and PCI slot positionings. Would you care to educate me on the background, or exact do's and don'ts?

BTW, My MB is a SOYO, and they call the Via chipset an ETEQ chipset although their own website acknowleges that it is just a renamed VIA--any ideas there? Thanks guys, just stay with me. If there is such a thing as open architecture, I'm not gonna let go! I'll even change Hardware, but I just wanna know what the problem is! and who is the real culprit who has cheated!!

Now to Haig--
Good effort should be rewarded (even when there is no answer within your control). As a newcomer to this forum, I can say that it is clear that you are doing a yeoman's job for the company that you work for. It is refreshing to see the occasional burst of honesty and clarity about various problems/issues that Matrox is dealing with, as opposed to the standard stonewall that I have sometimes encountered. Bravo!!

Having said that, I think you should know that as a result of earlier postings on this forum related to my problems, I've fielded several private e-mails from customers of Matrox who encountered what looks to me like a pattern from Matrox Technical support--one that I noticed. I think you need to officially address it--because I noticed the same thing.

Two issues
1. Front line (or 1st wave) tech support response, and
2. Where RMA's originate. (You need the power)

My e-mail address is in my profile.

Oh! One last thing. You've given me hope re: the ongoing support!

Careful now, I asked for honesty!

--region code don't matter to me--I'm 1 and happy, but there is a specific hack on DVDutils by a nice fella who purports to have corrected that, allowing unlimited resets. Several other threads in the last few days have mentioned it. His utility also had a registry hack that fixed another issue. I wrote him, and I'm sure he'd gladly show you what he did. --Seems to work, although I'm not qualified to evaluate. Hey!! Do like Netscape--take all the help you can get.

[Zwisch]

Hi,

Slot 2 or 3 are usualy the best slot for BUS MASTERING on a motherboard. The rest of the slot will usualy share their resources with another device (slot 1 shares with AGP for example.... This will be specific to each mobo.

As for your VIA (ETEC) chipset, it should not be related to your current problems sicne you can bypas it in another hardware profile. If the chipset was interfeering, you wouldn't be able to do anything.

I also think that at least one configuration might work, but the question is : is it worth the trouble...?

Let us know if the additional suggested fix gives you a hand or any improvements!

If I am not mistaken the patch that Haig was talking about is only for the software DVD version , not the one that comes with the hardware... so that wouldn't help you much... but then again I could be wrong

Z

[Bixler]

Zwisch,

Promise card is currently in second slot below AGP--therefore not sharing with my Marvel. Are you suggesting that I move to slot 3 or 4? (certainly not Slot 1) They are available, but some suggestions about what to look for might help before I bust open my box again.

I'll try it out and report back.

The other request in this thread was some suggestions RE mb/chipset/processor combo's that are more stable and universally supported. Would YOU go with a BX? Is there a better? I'm not a hardcore gamer--more interested in video and graphics editing, but my box is jam full of IDE devices (4) and I've had real fits getting them to all peacefully coexist. --I've got 2 hard drives, a CDburner and a Creative DVD. I bought the Promise card and installed it in order to give each IDE a Master/no slave config, which was the most stable way to run my burner.--Wrong choice? Better way to go?