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  • my Raptor user experience

    I received my Raptor order from Egghead last week, and after some preliminary testing over the weekend I can offer some opinions and observations.

    First some background. Up to now I have been using a Marvel G200, but the results have been so unsatisfactory that it basically is only used for the TV tuner. Why unsatisfactory? Two words: dropped frames. I have a monster system with a fasttrak and despite all my tweaking I could never escape multiple drops per minute even on low quality settings.

    Anyway, to continue... Installation of the Raptor was straight-forward. I had one remaining PCI slot in my BH6 mobo so I stuck it there. Booted up. Fasttrak wouldn't initialize the harddrives. Oh no. Well I've seen this before, the Fasttrak is very picky on what PCI slot it has and what its neighbors are. So I swapped the cards' PCI slots. Booted up. It worked.

    Next, the driver install. The software comes on 5 floppy disks, which was surprising in this day and age of everything coming on a CD. Again it was straight-forward. The entire process took about 15 minutes including having to swap those cards. The funniest thing about the procedure was from the manual, which states:
    "This product is not intended for and should not be used for medical purposes, or with any equipment which might be used for life support."

    Uh, okay.

    Next, I fire up Premiere 5.1. Following the instructions in the manual, I connect my Sony TRV-103 via the firewire connector and begin to browse one of my tapes using Premiere's Capture utility. I select in/out points, click to record, and away it goes. Device Control! Yes! What a concept. It works flawlessly.

    Next I experimented with Raptor Video, which is Canopus' utility for capturing video. This time I stick in one of my 8mm tapes shot from my previous camcorder. No timecode or batch capture here (with 8mm), but you still have device control. I recorded back onto VHS (a very simple procedure), and there was no "fluctuating" (as discussed on another thread) at all. I may test using some different 8mm tapes to see if it will occur.

    I did several tests where I alternated 8mm and D8 footage. Quality on both when laying back out to VHS was superb. Hey, it's digital, what would you expect?

    What about dropped frames? During one 4-minute clip from a 8mm tape I noticed a glitch in the capture. But that was it. If it was a dropped frame, it's a huge improvement over what I was having with the Marvel. In several minutes of D8 footage I had no glitches. From what I've read, if you are batch capturing and you drop a frame, it automatically will go back and fill in that frame. I can't be sure exactly how or if this works though.

    I haven't had a chance to play with the Raptor Navigator software either. It logs your D8/DV tapes and seems like a very handy tool. I only have one filled D8 tape at present but I suppose you could record something from analog to D8 and get your timecode that way.

    The Raptor and Marvel appear to co-exist just fine. I didn't run any extensive tests, but the good old TV tuner was still doing its job.

    I would be remiss if I didn't point out the Premiere preview rendering bug. Apparently there's a problem where in some circustances you would be forced to re-render transitions that were already rendered. While I probably will be doing a majority of straight cuts, I hope this is something they address soon.

    So in conclusion, I am very happy with this hardware. It truly seems to be the Holy Grail of desktop video that I have been searching for all these years. It's been a long search...dating back to 1994 when I first wasted a lot of money on the Orchid Videola Pro. I was beginning to think that video editing on the computer wouldn't be possible without extreme sacrifices in quality or cost. With the Raptor, this is no longer the case. I highly recommend this card.

    Brian

  • #2
    Might as well include my system specs in case you're curious:

    --Celeron 550MHz (overclocked 366), 128MB, Abit BH6 motherboard
    --Win98
    --Marvel G200 (AGP)
    --Diamond Voodoo2
    --Canopus Raptor
    --Promise Fasttrak (NOT 66)
    --generic network card
    --Montego II sound card
    --Seagate Medalist Pro (main HD)
    --two Maxtor 8.4GB 4320 (Fasttrak)
    --Epson 750 printer (USB)
    --HP Deskjet 500 printer (parallel) (yes, it's ancient but dependable)
    --Zip drive (parallel)
    --DSL modem
    --USB mouse
    --joystick
    --17" Dell Ultrascan monitor
    --Wacom tablet (currently not installed)

    Reformatted and reinstalled everything two weeks ago.


    [This message has been edited by BrianP (edited 25 October 1999).]

    Comment


    • #3
      Yep... the Canopus products are now
      the **industry standard** for
      reliability and functionality.

      Comment


      • #4
        i dont get it i really dont???
        ive been using my marvel g200 for a year now for numerous projects, and even capturing like 15,20 mins at a time
        and have NEVER HAD ANY DROPPED FRAMES
        at all, it has always worked flawlessly

        am i just incredibly lucky?????

        there must be others out there who have joy the same as I??????
        Windows XP Pro + SP1 - Pentium 4 3.1gig - 1024mg DDR 333 2 cas - Thermaltake Xaser Case - Parhelia 128 - 3x Phillips TFT Monitors - Audigy 2 Platinum - 6.1 surround speakers - RTx100 - 5 HD 7200rpm (420gig) - Pioneer A03 - Partridge in a pear tree

        Comment


        • #5
          Well I ran an hour capture session just last week as a test, and dropped one in 1000 frames. Now that is acceptable to me

          Comment


          • #6
            Jerry,

            By saying that Canopus has set the industry standard is being a bit narrow minded.

            There are many products (and I'm not being biosed towards Matrox) out in the market that make your Raptor look like a DC10.

            I agree it may be a great product but "industry standard" I think not

            Regards,
            Elie



            [This message has been edited by Elie (edited 25 October 1999).]

            Comment


            • #7
              I know that the Raptor has solved my skiped frames here and there syndrom. On my Rainbow runner setup I had 2 mobo's, 2 hd's and I was never able to achieve perfect flow. Most people would never notice it and I suspect those are the ones saying they never had any problems. Some of us are more picky. There are some aspects of the Raptor that make it less "handy" than the RR but it also has some slick features I'm really going to enjoy! I'm glad some people aren't having any problems with the Rainbow Runner. Does anyone want to buy a Mystique and Rainbow Runner?

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi, without starting a big debate
                im as picky as they come.
                I have been into video for years,
                am tv/video/film student and work with professional broadcast quality equipment.as im sure a lot of us do
                It just happens that our setups work well

                you cant say were just not looking hard enough!!!! :O)

                i wish you well with your raptor and hope you accomplish Great things with it :O)

                After all these cards are just editing tools for us master craftsman after all

                hell i remember when i was editing with a 8mm cam and a 1 vcr Those were the days i can tell you

                *probably none of this message makes sense, its late and im up far past my bedtime :O)
                Windows XP Pro + SP1 - Pentium 4 3.1gig - 1024mg DDR 333 2 cas - Thermaltake Xaser Case - Parhelia 128 - 3x Phillips TFT Monitors - Audigy 2 Platinum - 6.1 surround speakers - RTx100 - 5 HD 7200rpm (420gig) - Pioneer A03 - Partridge in a pear tree

                Comment


                • #9
                  Elie...

                  You have every right to disagree.

                  However, I stick by what I said.

                  Canopus is the new "standard" for
                  reliability.

                  Matrox... is also a very good company.
                  I'd rank them second to Canopus.

                  My experience has been that Matrox released
                  the Rainbow Runner and it initially
                  exhibited a "verticle blue line" problem
                  that was quickly fixed.

                  Later, some folks noticed transitions
                  were problematic... and Matrox fixed that.

                  Matrox absolutely deserves credit for
                  sticking by customers and a relatively
                  inexpensive board with subsequent updates
                  and improvements.

                  And everybody knows about the upper end
                  products like the DigiSuite.

                  And as posters here have mentioned, the
                  newer boards released by Matrox (Marvel, etc.) have been good performers.

                  But I have to be honest with you, Elie.

                  The Canopus products have worked right
                  out of the box from the get-go and that's
                  surprising in this day and age of non-linear
                  PC products... particularly where DV is
                  concerned.

                  The Matrox RT2000 represents the first
                  real "DV" product that Matrox have released
                  (and they're a bit late in doing so).

                  As many observers at DV Expo will tell you,
                  the DV quality of the C-Cube chip inside
                  the RT2000 is great. However, the
                  MPEG-2 quality is said to be so-so.

                  We'll see when you buy yours.

                  Personally, I wouldn't buy a product for
                  the PC that wasn't made by either Matrox
                  or Canopus. The rest... as far as I'm
                  concerned... are either unreliable or
                  too mired in the Macintosh way of doing
                  things.


                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I would completely agree that what makes a successful editing solution is based largely on whether the individual has the freedom to express their creativity and have fun. You don't need a $5000 board to do that. At the same time, each of us has certain expectations on what is acceptable. For some it's broadcast quality, or realtime transitions.

                    I was a broadcasting major, and worked at a TV station and at a post-production house in Washington, DC. But I didn't need BetaSP quality or fancy effects. For myself, years ago (and even today to some degree) I would be happy with VHS quality, as long as the video was smooth. My first attempt was in 1994 with the Orchid Videola. It had 640x480 at 30fps (although not 60 fields/sec). I don't even remember what the compression on it was. I would have been happy with it. The problem was the board was a piece of junk. It had severe overheating problems and simply wouldn't function for more than a few minutes. (Several other users had the same problems.) I still cringe at the thought of how much money I threw away on that card.

                    Years later I decided the video board market had matured enough to try again. Enter the Marvel. A much better offering this time, and I certainly can't complain about the quality. But for whatever reason, on my system the thing just dropped frames like hot potatoes. Average quality I could accept, dropped frames I could not.

                    Along comes the Raptor. Okay the quality is unbelievable from my D8 camcorder. But all along my main criteria has been a smooth and uninterrupted video playback. Is it so much to ask? Well now I finally have it, and I am so happy. I'm finally editing my Rome vacation video. I have all sorts of video plans and ideas. My creative juices are starting to flow again. And that's what it's all about.

                    I have no agenda to get other people to buy or use one product over another. I just want people to have information that might help them find their perfect video board, the one that fits their needs.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      About dropped frames...

                      i just bought a new HardDrive for video editing...

                      So i've been testing the capture feature of my Marvel a lot these days...

                      in one capture of about 2 Hours
                      ( 215 768 frames )... i had only 2 dropped frames (with avi_io)... and i caused them by opening and closing Audio mixer while recording..

                      to continue with the tests... i captured at full resolution, least compression (Max quality)... for about 30 minutes...
                      no dropped frames!!! (0)

                      with PC-VCR... i recall having 1 hour recording with 3-4 dropped frames max...at full res. max. qual.

                      - now, the same day i started doing these captures, i installed a little fan on the heatsink of my marvel (AGP) ... (cause...HOT!!!)
                      maybe it captures better while cooler...


                      Here's my HW:

                      Marvel G200-TV AGP
                      PII 400 Mhz
                      Asus Motherboard P2B
                      256 Meg RAM
                      Windows 98 SE french
                      SB16 AWE32
                      Maxtor 9.1 GB IDE
                      WesternDigital 8.4 Gb IDE
                      Maxtor 27.2 Gb ( new ) IDE

                      MATROX Drivers: 5.15
                      Video tools 1.51


                      [This message has been edited by Migou (edited 26 October 1999).]
                      ------------------------------
                      Hardware:
                      Maxtrox Marvel G200-TV AGP.....|.Windows 98 SE
                      PII 400 Mhz ( no overclock )......|.Maxtor 9.1 Gb (IDE)
                      Asus P2B...............................|.Western Digital 8.4 Gb (IDE)
                      256 Meg RAM..........................|.Maxtor 27.2 Gb (IDE)
                      SB16 AWE32...........................|.Lexmark 7000
                      Cable Modem

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        About dropped frames:

                        I'm willing to bet that if your local
                        TV station is still editing news packages
                        from tape deck to tape deck... you will
                        have a difficult time recording that type
                        of video with an analog capture card
                        without encountering certain edit points where you'll drop frames.

                        I've had a lot of experience with this
                        problem and it has to do with
                        time base correction and frame synchronization.

                        The advantage of digital formats such as
                        MiniDV and Digital 8 is that time base
                        correction and frame synchronization
                        are no longer problems.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The problems on some abit and other boards were NOT for captures, but for playing MJPEG files.

                          I could not do this for a long time. Yes, I could capture from a good source for a long time without dropped frames. Playback was always jerky - one or two frames dropped every minute.

                          Raptor works perfectly on the SAME PC, with SAME system, SAME drivers for all hardware inside, for 4 months. I never got any trouble with it. I became so lazy that did not reinstall windows 98 for half a year, and even G200 drivers are still very old. I just have no need to improve anything. Sounds strange - that is what I got with Raptor.


                          Yes, it is an industry standard for this class of devices.
                          Please, do not refer to another class, these comparisons do not work for home users.

                          Grigory

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Just an addendum:

                            Canopus has posted a fix for the Premiere preview rendering bug, so that issue is now moot. With that out of the way, I don't see any major drawbacks to this card.

                            Oh, they also just released an analog capture driver for the Raptor, too. No hardware compression obviously so my Marvel is still much better suited for that sort of thing. But it's a nice thing to have if the Raptor is your only video board.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              BrianP

                              Analog capture driver for the Raptor???

                              Are you saying it is going to grab video from the composite loop connector?

                              -Anthony
                              Anthony
                              • Slot 1 Celeron 400, Asus P2B, 256MB PC-100
                              • AGP Marvel-TV 8MB NTSC
                              • Turtle Beach Montego PCI sound card
                              • C: IBM 10.1, 5400, Primary on 1, System, Swap, Software
                              • D: IBM 13.5, 5400, Primary on 2, Dedicated to video
                              • E: Memorex 48x CD, Secondary on 1
                              • F: Yamaha CD-RW 2x2x8, Secondary on 2
                              • Win98, FAT32 on C: & D:
                              • MediaStudio Pro 5.2

                              Comment

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